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----- Original Message ----- From: "Aldo Solari [APS]" <aldo.solari@ho*.se*> To: <techdiver@aquanaut.com>; <RDecker388@ao*.co*> Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2001 11:44 PM Subject: Re[6]: UNESCO > Mr. Decker, you do not only ignore what UNESCO has done for > cultural heritage and the biosphere worldwide but dont have the > slightest idea on fish population dynamics. You are the typical > "blue collar america" who insult, kick around and shout due lack > of arguments, education and respect for others. While I cannot > culturize you through an electronic forum, I urge you to go to > some evening courses at the university, read about what you like > to discuss and watch up your mouth. > > Without a track record in scientific research or diving, you > hardly have a place to argue here. And your track record is......? BTW, while you're admonishing others, what say we stop using words like 'terrorism' to describe actions we don't like? Dennis > > ---- > aldo.solari@ho*.se* (fisheries biologist) > Home page, www.ccbb.ulpgc.es/fish-ecology/solaris > ---- > > RDecker388@ao*.co* > > Rac> In a message dated 10/23/01 10:26:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > Rac> aldo.solari@ho*.se* writes: > > > >> . Wreckers should study basics in law, cultural > >> heritage, social anthropology and archeology. Nobody will get > >> killed by going to some seminars, reading some material and doing > >> some field work with specialized instructors. > >> > > Rac> Tell you what, Chief, I studied archeology, the underwater variety to be > Rac> specific, while in college. I even gave a bit of thought to doing degree > Rac> work in anthropology. I know several professional archeologists well, > Rac> particularly those specializing in submerged cultureal materials. Wanna hear > Rac> my "enlighted and educated" view of UNESCO? It stinks. It will do nothing > Rac> to protect anything worth protecting, will result in a "black market" of > Rac> wreck diving and fishing resulting in the location of potentially culturally > Rac> significant sites going unreported and has the potential to destroy the > Rac> recreational diving industry. > > Rac> You use passionate, insulting commentary such as "terrorists," "wreck > Rac> grubbers" and "cutural resource killers," yet likely have never been involved > Rac> in an underwater archeological project yourself. You come off as someone > Rac> lost in the hallowed halls of academia with little or no understading of the > Rac> real world and how it works. > > Rac> The fact is, the majority of the wreck divers I know are fairly conciencious > Rac> people. They aren't about to strip artifacts off of any sites that are > Rac> truely significant cultural resources. The vast majority of worthwhile sites > Rac> that have been identified have been found and reported by sport divers, not > Rac> professional archeologists. In contrast, archeologist often are the worst > Rac> hackers/destroyers/treasure hunters that exist. Take a trip to Port Royal > Rac> Jamaica and see the rotting, rusting, crumbling artifacts left to waste away > Rac> by archeologists due largely to a lack of funding. These items are of some > Rac> significance and obviously would be better cared for if in the hands of a few > Rac> "wreck gutters," who would conserve and display them, instead of in the hands > Rac> of professional archeologists! > > Rac> Here's a thought. You want to protect all the wrecks laying in your > Rac> country's sovereign waters, go for it. However, if you want to muddle in the > Rac> territorial waters of other countries, thanks but no thanks, we'll keep care > Rac> of our own. > > Rac> (I'm not even going to touch the nonsense you put forward concerning fishing, > Rac> degradation of fish stocks, etc. A six year old with a kindergarten > Rac> education would recognize that for a crock of bull). > > > Rac> your wrote-------- > > Rac> Art, there are three points I would like to clarify: > > Rac> (1). There are international guidelines (given by UNESCO) for the > Rac> concept of "cultural/natural heritage" on both sea and land. In > Rac> principle, everything *is* cultural/natural heritage unless > Rac> declared otherwise. And this goes beyond the interest of many of > Rac> those divers who "take a piece home" (ie. deny to others the very > Rac> same sites where they themslves liked to dive); > > Rac> (2). Combination of scuba gear + spear fishing is forbidden in > Rac> many countries. The reason is very clear: spear fishing combined > Rac> to scuba gear imply the local extinction of many coastal fish > Rac> species. A well of scientific (exclusion) studies have been > Rac> conducted on this in the Mediterranean; even the sole presence of > Rac> divers (who just watch) is known to disturb many species. > > > Rac> (3). Mixing up spear fishing and trawling is demagogy: spear > Rac> fishing is aimed at coastal species while trawling is done on > Rac> demersal or pelagic species at a minimum of 5 km off the shore. > Rac> The species are different. While trawling is known to collapse > Rac> fish populations so does spear fishing in coastal systems. > > Rac> The level of education in the diver population is low both here > Rac> and in the US. Training is solely technical, quality is bad and > Rac> it lacks several subjects which are highly significant. There > Rac> should be course work at university level for those interested in > Rac> a diving license. The University of Barcelona (Spain), for > Rac> instance, has started such couses and it is a very fine > Rac> initiative. Wreckers should study basics in law, cultural > Rac> heritage, social anthropology and archeology. Nobody will get > Rac> killed by going to some seminars, reading some material and doing > Rac> some field work with specialized instructors. > > Rac> In the US, course work is always expensive. However, you could > Rac> talk to many people from public universities who -I am sure- will > Rac> be more than glad to talk you through 4-5 seminars on diving > Rac> related aspects for free. > > Rac> Cheers, > > Rac> ---- > Rac> aldo.solari@ho*.se* (fisheries biologist) > Rac> Home page, www.ccbb.ulpgc.es/fish-ecology/solaris > Rac> ---- > > > -- > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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