Mailing List Archive Mailing List Archive
I was an educational snob like that when I worked at the university and was publishing articles myself. However, a few years in the real world and I learned that people make their living in many different ways. A formal education is not a guarantee for success, nor is it a guarantee of being smart. I have found, through personal experience with Bob Decker, that he is a thoughtful, intelligent and thinking human being who can logically look at both sides of a situation. The personal attacks on him are unwarranted. Calling wreckers and others terrorists and saying blue collar Americans right now doesn't sit well. Being passionate about a subject does not mean you need to be disrespectful, nor does it mean that you need to carry it to two boards. H. Preston Hobbie FAX and Phone 317-891-8072 -----Original Message----- From: Aldo Solari [APS] [mailto:aldo.solari@ho*.se*] Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2001 11:44 PM To: techdiver@aquanaut.com; RDecker388@ao*.co* Subject: Re[6]: UNESCO Mr. Decker, you do not only ignore what UNESCO has done for cultural heritage and the biosphere worldwide but dont have the slightest idea on fish population dynamics. You are the typical "blue collar america" who insult, kick around and shout due lack of arguments, education and respect for others. While I cannot culturize you through an electronic forum, I urge you to go to some evening courses at the university, read about what you like to discuss and watch up your mouth. Without a track record in scientific research or diving, you hardly have a place to argue here. ---- aldo.solari@ho*.se* (fisheries biologist) Home page, www.ccbb.ulpgc.es/fish-ecology/solaris ---- RDecker388@ao*.co* Rac> In a message dated 10/23/01 10:26:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Rac> aldo.solari@ho*.se* writes: >> . Wreckers should study basics in law, cultural >> heritage, social anthropology and archeology. Nobody will get >> killed by going to some seminars, reading some material and doing >> some field work with specialized instructors. >> Rac> Tell you what, Chief, I studied archeology, the underwater variety to be Rac> specific, while in college. I even gave a bit of thought to doing degree Rac> work in anthropology. I know several professional archeologists well, Rac> particularly those specializing in submerged cultureal materials. Wanna hear Rac> my "enlighted and educated" view of UNESCO? It stinks. It will do nothing Rac> to protect anything worth protecting, will result in a "black market" of Rac> wreck diving and fishing resulting in the location of potentially culturally Rac> significant sites going unreported and has the potential to destroy the Rac> recreational diving industry. Rac> You use passionate, insulting commentary such as "terrorists," "wreck Rac> grubbers" and "cutural resource killers," yet likely have never been involved Rac> in an underwater archeological project yourself. You come off as someone Rac> lost in the hallowed halls of academia with little or no understading of the Rac> real world and how it works. Rac> The fact is, the majority of the wreck divers I know are fairly conciencious Rac> people. They aren't about to strip artifacts off of any sites that are Rac> truely significant cultural resources. The vast majority of worthwhile sites Rac> that have been identified have been found and reported by sport divers, not Rac> professional archeologists. In contrast, archeologist often are the worst Rac> hackers/destroyers/treasure hunters that exist. Take a trip to Port Royal Rac> Jamaica and see the rotting, rusting, crumbling artifacts left to waste away Rac> by archeologists due largely to a lack of funding. These items are of some Rac> significance and obviously would be better cared for if in the hands of a few Rac> "wreck gutters," who would conserve and display them, instead of in the hands Rac> of professional archeologists! Rac> Here's a thought. You want to protect all the wrecks laying in your Rac> country's sovereign waters, go for it. However, if you want to muddle in the Rac> territorial waters of other countries, thanks but no thanks, we'll keep care Rac> of our own. Rac> (I'm not even going to touch the nonsense you put forward concerning fishing, Rac> degradation of fish stocks, etc. A six year old with a kindergarten Rac> education would recognize that for a crock of bull). Rac> your wrote-------- Rac> Art, there are three points I would like to clarify: Rac> (1). There are international guidelines (given by UNESCO) for the Rac> concept of "cultural/natural heritage" on both sea and land. In Rac> principle, everything *is* cultural/natural heritage unless Rac> declared otherwise. And this goes beyond the interest of many of Rac> those divers who "take a piece home" (ie. deny to others the very Rac> same sites where they themslves liked to dive); Rac> (2). Combination of scuba gear + spear fishing is forbidden in Rac> many countries. The reason is very clear: spear fishing combined Rac> to scuba gear imply the local extinction of many coastal fish Rac> species. A well of scientific (exclusion) studies have been Rac> conducted on this in the Mediterranean; even the sole presence of Rac> divers (who just watch) is known to disturb many species. Rac> (3). Mixing up spear fishing and trawling is demagogy: spear Rac> fishing is aimed at coastal species while trawling is done on Rac> demersal or pelagic species at a minimum of 5 km off the shore. Rac> The species are different. While trawling is known to collapse Rac> fish populations so does spear fishing in coastal systems. Rac> The level of education in the diver population is low both here Rac> and in the US. Training is solely technical, quality is bad and Rac> it lacks several subjects which are highly significant. There Rac> should be course work at university level for those interested in Rac> a diving license. The University of Barcelona (Spain), for Rac> instance, has started such couses and it is a very fine Rac> initiative. Wreckers should study basics in law, cultural Rac> heritage, social anthropology and archeology. Nobody will get Rac> killed by going to some seminars, reading some material and doing Rac> some field work with specialized instructors. Rac> In the US, course work is always expensive. However, you could Rac> talk to many people from public universities who -I am sure- will Rac> be more than glad to talk you through 4-5 seminars on diving Rac> related aspects for free. Rac> Cheers, Rac> ---- Rac> aldo.solari@ho*.se* (fisheries biologist) Rac> Home page, www.ccbb.ulpgc.es/fish-ecology/solaris Rac> ---- -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
Navigate by Author:
[Previous]
[Next]
[Author Search Index]
Navigate by Subject:
[Previous]
[Next]
[Subject Search Index]
[Send Reply] [Send Message with New Topic]
[Search Selection] [Mailing List Home] [Home]