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My highest priority in diving is to have a fun dive with no clusterfucks to
worry about in the first place.

Honestly the way I see some people equip and prepare themselves it reminds
me of the cartoons where the guy steps out of the airplane pulls the rip
cord and his suitcase contents,  pants, nightshirt, socks, underwear, etc.,
come flying out of the parachute backpack instead of a parachute. Except in
this case the end results are not so funny.

  Jim
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Learn About Trimix at http://www.cisatlantic.com/trimix/

From: "Sean T. Stevenson" <ststev@un*.co*>
Reply-To: "Sean T. Stevenson" <ststev@un*.co*>
Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 08:56:48 -0700
To: "Dogtrner1@ao*.co*" <Dogtrner1@ao*.co*>, "Jim Cobb"
<cobber@ci*.co*>, "techdiver@aquanaut.com" <techdiver@aquanaut.com>
Subject: Re: What's a diver to do.


Having said that, Jim, I think it should still be pointed out that it is
possible to briefly interrupt and then resume decompression.  What is your
highest priority when diving?  Mine is my buddy's safety.  With that in
mind, there's no way I'm going to let him blow up to the surface without
following, so that I may either correct the problem and get him back down,
or hand him off to surface support and drop down to deco.  How much deco you
are willing to blow off is certainly a judgement call, but within a
reasonable window of a few minutes surfaced I think my buddy deserves the
effort.

After surfacing for a couple of minutes, I would probably return to
something a little deeper than the interruption depth (maybe 5/4th's or so),
and resume the schedule with no changes, other than extending the oxygen
stop a bit.  If symptoms were evident, I'd throw on the full face mask and
drop to 25 feet on oxygen with a support diver - standard IWR protocol.

As you pointed out, the best thing is prevention, by not making poor
decisions prior to the dive.  After that, you have to weigh the possibility
of a little pain versus potentially having a death on your hands.

I'll take the pain every time.

-Sean


--Original Message Text---
From: Jim Cobb
Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 09:13:51 -0400

Re: What's a diver to do. This is a commonly happens among rec divers,
that's why in rec diving you try to keep the amount of dissolved gasses in
your tissues down to a point where, due to inexperience or poor equipment
selection or both, "shooting to the surface" happens all the time. If you
can remember to exhale on the way up it generally won't cause a problems.
You see this happening all the time on the rec trips around here.

Technical diving is a whole new ballgame. In technical diving you have a
"virtual overhead" which means that if you have a problem you'd better be
prepared to handle it without shooting to the surface, which in many cases
is a death penalty.

With this in mind you equip yourself with the correct gear, learn to work
with this gear until it becomes instinctive and have the ability to keep a
cool head when the situation is less than optimal.

Your question is kind of like "if I were skydiving and my partner's chute
did not open do I follow him to the ground trying to help him". I don't
believe this is taught or even considered in skydiving. The emphasis in on
setting up your equipment correctly and learning it intimately.

In the case in question it appears that either the deceased was hypoxic and
could not think straight or his equipment was all fucked up. That his
partner could not help him means that not only was his gear so fucked up he
could not deal with a simple drysuit problem that his partner has hypoxic as
well or so unfamiliar with the gear they were using she could not figure it
out. Keep in mind this was a shore dive, sitting on the bottom, all the time
in the world (they were using rebreather, right?) One or both of these two
were fated to die long before they even got in the water.

So, what would I do? First I would not dive with a know killer rebreather
like the Buddy Expiration, second I would dive with a partner who knew my
equipment as well as I do so you can deal with the problem on the bottom.
The point is you don't let the situation get to the point that you have to
make decisions like the one you make below, it is not hard to do. I repeat,
it is NOT hard to do.

Jim





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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>Re: What's a diver to do.</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
My highest priority in diving is to have a fun dive with no clusterfucks to=
 worry about in the first place. <BR>
<BR>
Honestly the way I see some people equip and prepare themselves it reminds =
me of the cartoons where the guy steps out of the airplane pulls the rip cor=
d and his suitcase contents,  pants, nightshirt, socks, underwear, etc.=
,  come flying out of the parachute backpack instead of a parachute. Ex=
cept in this case the end results are not so funny.<BR>
<BR>
   Jim<BR>
 -------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
 Learn About Trimix at http://www.cisatlantic.com/trimix/<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<B>From: </B>"Sean T. Stevenson" <ststev@un*.co*><BR>
<B>Reply-To: </B>"Sean T. Stevenson" <ststev@un*.co*><=
BR>
<B>Date: </B>Wed, 04 Jul 2001 08:56:48 -0700<BR>
<B>To: </B>"Dogtrner1@ao*.co*" <Dogtrner1@ao*.co*>,
"J=
im Cobb" <cobber@ci*.co*>, "techdiver@aquanaut.com&q=
uot; <techdiver@aquanaut.com><BR>
<B>Subject: </B>Re: What's a diver to do.<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><FONT SIZE=3D"1">Having said that, Jim, I think it should
still b=
e pointed out that it is possible to briefly interrupt and then resume decom=
pression.  What is your highest priority when diving?  Mine is my =
buddy's safety.  With that in mind, there's no way I'm going to let him=
 blow up to the surface without following, so that I may either correct the =
problem and get him back down, or hand him off to surface support and drop d=
own to deco.  How much deco you are willing to blow off is certainly a =
judgement call, but within a reasonable window of a few minutes surfaced I t=
hink my buddy deserves the effort.<BR>
<BR>
After surfacing for a couple of minutes, I would probably return to somethi=
ng a little deeper than the interruption depth (maybe 5/4th's or so), and re=
sume the schedule with no changes, other than extending the oxygen stop a bi=
t.  If symptoms were evident, I'd throw on the full face mask and drop =
to 25 feet on oxygen with a support diver - standard IWR protocol.<BR>
<BR>
As you pointed out, the best thing is prevention, by not making poor decisi=
ons prior to the dive.  After that, you have to weigh the possibility o=
f a little pain versus potentially having a death on your hands.  <BR>
<BR>
I'll take the pain every time.<BR>
<BR>
-Sean<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
--Original Message Text---<BR>
<B>From:</B> Jim Cobb<BR>
<B>Date:</B> Wed, 04 Jul 2001 09:13:51 -0400<BR>
<BR>
Re: What's a diver to do. This is a commonly happens among rec divers, that=
's why in rec diving you try to keep the amount of dissolved gasses in your =
tissues down to a point where, due to inexperience or poor equipment selecti=
on or both, "shooting to the surface" happens all the time. If you=
 can remember to exhale on the way up it generally won't cause a problems. Y=
ou see this happening all the time on the rec trips around here.<BR>
<BR>
Technical diving is a whole new ballgame. In technical diving you have a &q=
uot;virtual overhead" which means that if you have a problem you'd bett=
er be prepared to handle it without shooting to the surface, which in many c=
ases is a death penalty.<BR>
<BR>
With this in mind you equip yourself with the correct gear, learn to work w=
ith this gear until it becomes instinctive and have the ability to keep a co=
ol head when the situation is less than optimal.<BR>
<BR>
Your question is kind of like "if I were skydiving and my partner's ch=
ute did not open do I follow him to the ground trying to help him". I d=
on't believe this is taught or even considered in skydiving. The emphasis in=
 on setting up your equipment correctly and learning it intimately.<BR>
<BR>
In the case in question it appears that either the deceased was hypoxic and=
 could not think straight or his equipment was all fucked up. That his partn=
er could not help him means that not only was his gear so fucked up he could=
 not deal with a simple drysuit problem that his partner has hypoxic as well=
 or so unfamiliar with the gear they were using she could not figure it out.=
 Keep in mind this was a shore dive, sitting on the bottom, all the time in =
the world (they were using rebreather, right?) One or both of these two were=
 fated to die long before they even got in the water.<BR>
<BR>
So, what would I do? First I would not dive with a know killer rebreather l=
ike the Buddy Expiration, second I would dive with a partner who knew my equ=
ipment as well as I do so you can deal with the problem on the bottom. The p=
oint is you don't let the situation get to the point that you have to make d=
ecisions like the one you make below, it is not hard to do. I repeat, it is =
NOT hard to do.<BR>
<BR>
Jim<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
</FONT></BLOCKQUOTE><FONT SIZE=3D"1"><BR>
</FONT>
</BODY>
</HTML>


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