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In a previous post Jim writes: <<Will one of you bonage aficiandos please explain to me again what exactly <<wonderful thing these POS do to offset the complexity, fear and doubt <<that they cause?>> Well Jim, I don't find my OMS wings to cause me (nor others I know that have and use them) any fear nor doubt. Fear of what? Doubt about what? I'm not afraid they will fail me, I'm not afraid they won't give me lift, I'm not afraid they will kill me. What fear is it you refer to? As to complexity?, well maybe I'm missing something here. Granted they have an additional strap (crotch strap) that the vest style BC I was using didn't have, they have a few extra D rings, integrated weights, what you refer to as "bungee cord", some extra padding and pockets but, they inflate and deflate just like the vest style BC I was using and I haven't found them to be "complex" to either operate or set up. So I guess (in my case at least) there is nothing to offset. <<It looks like you all have agreed that the setup of the bondage, the hose <<storage and routing, training, maintenance of the overpressure valves are <<extremely critical to keep these from killing you. What justifies this?>> Well lets see. I give mine the same maintenence that I would give any BC. I route my hoses the same way that I did with the vest style BC. As with any new piece of gear, I practiced with it in a known environment first. I set up my "bungee cords" in such a manner as to give me a slight heads up orientation when horizontal (something I couldn't do with the vest style BC). Other than just the one item (bungee set up) nothing else was different than any other BC so therefor, nothing "extremely critical" had to be done to keep them from killing me. <<So you have 2 bladders? How would you puncture one of them, by ripping <<the outer shell, correct? If the outer shell is ripped, what exactly <<keeps the other bladder contained?>> Got 1 bladder. I got the OMS IQ 100# single bladder. If the outer shell gets ripped, it may still be the one thing that prevents the bladder from also being ripped. With the cords in place (the cords by the way are sort of an option you don't have to install if you don't want) my bladder stays tucked in closer and I'm more apt to bang my cylinders before anything reaches it. <<How many of you have had standard wing failures which drove you to using <<bondage wings? What was the nature of the failure and how do bondage <<wings mitigate that failure point?>> Never had a wing failure so I don't know first hand about them nor the failure points. <<And how many were talked into these by a diveshop salesman or instructor?>> Well, I was talked into them by my friend. Yes he is an instructor. I did have an opportunity to try some different styles. My friend has been diving longer, has had the opportunity to try many styles of wings (he does own a dive shop) and he has figured out thru use and evaluation, what works better for the type of diving he does. I was able to shortcut the buy it, use it, dump it and buy something else route. <<And how many bought these things because you wanted to look cool, just <<like the other bondage technecule divers?>> I learned a long time ago that buying things to look "cool" doesn't cut it at all. Don't care what people think about my gear. Bottom line is, it works for me, it ain't broke so no need to fix it. My life depends on my gear so I maintain it, I train with it and if I'm not comfortable with it I won't use it. I follow that both in diving and in my profession. Besides, if I want to look "cool" I'll hang around the donut shop with mirrored sunglasses and a coffee cup in one hand, ticket book in the other. :-) <<How many of you are just stubborn brick-heads who are keeping their <<stupid bondage wings just out of mulish principle?>> I almost said guilty, guilty, guilty. But I'm really not stubborn. If something that I think is better comes along, I'll get it. I am rather open minded. If something is proven to me, I'll accept it but if it isn't proven, then I won't accept it. <<How many of you have tried standard wings and rejected them for the <<bondage? What was the reason for this rejection, really?>> In part,I will readily admit, price. I could get the OMS for less. But also I found them a bit more stable for me and I liked being able to adjust my orientation head slightly up, down or level. Plus, I found that they held the bladder in a bit closer so that the cylinder gave them a bit of protection (and in single cylinder application they don't wrap around the cylinder) and faster air evacuation. And finally ( a big consideration for me) I found them more comfortable on my shoulders and put less strain on my back and neck. Since I have been injured a time or two over the course of my career, comfort and less strain on my neck and back were prime considerations for me so long as safety wasn't an issue (which it isn't). <<How do you explain the constant stream of bondage wings for sale on this <<and the cavers list? They are by far and away the most popular item for <<sale on these lists.>> Can't explain it. Hype? Paranoia? Marketing stratagy? Who knows for sure? If people are really that eager to dump them I may buy another. But guarentee that I won't pay what they are asking. If "they" think it's junk, I'd be willing to give them 10 cents on the dollar (depending on condition) and they can pay the shipping. <<Lets get to the bottom of this issue once and for all. <<Jim>> Sure, lets get to the bottom of it. But lets not blame them for deaths when they may not have even been a factor. So many things can go wrong. Sometimes, when a diver dies, it is not any one thing that kills them but rather a combination of events that individually would not have been fatal but collectively were. And if wings were one of the events involved, was it because they were "bondage" style, dual bladder, one particular brand, suffered a maintenence related failure or because they were brand new to the diver and being used for the first time along with other new items and/or training. I was always taught that if I added new gear / equipment, add only one thing at a time and try it out in a more confined / familier area and don't make any other changes or additions until I was comfortable with what I had just changed. Guess you could say it's a common sense thing. Sadly, common sense is none to common lately. Well, I've put my 2 cents in (for what it's worth) and if there are replys, maybe I will learn something. That's why I first subscribed to techdiver. To learn. So far, it hasn't really lived up to my expectations but who knows? Maybe someday it shall. Dan ******************************************** Press hard, it's 5 copies.............. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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