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This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C2519D.BE15A4C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Scot I want to answer your questions, hopefully before anyone else answers = for me.=20 First of all let me start by saying I am trained up to NAUI Technical = and Extended Range. I have read many of the manuals from GUE and I guess = read much of what is placed on the WKPP web site. I have made 300 notable dive many of them on this one wreck which I have = spoken about which bottoms out at 41m or 120ft approx for you guys in = US. Their are no noteable caves in Cyprus and unfortunately I do not = think their is anyone over here qualified to give a cave specialty = course. I have done the wreck specialty PADI for what its worth :) But = other than that I have only my own experience and the knowledge I have = learnt from other well trained divers who I have dived and learnt much = from. Most of my dives in the past year are conducted with twins using the = Halcyon backplate and wings with Apex regulators and long hose etc. One = small reel in my dry suit pocket and larger reel on my rig. Two lift = bags and spare mask. Mix always Nitrox 28 or 30 mix and one stage bottle = clipped to my rig with a 50/50. What I tried to point out to other divers on the list is that thinking = to ones self I have dived many times on the same wreck and know it = intimately does not mean you can become so complacent as I did. It was a = week day dive and all my regular buddies were working and I was having a = short holiday and wanted to dive so I felt my knowledge of Zenobia wreck = was enough for me to dive it solo even though there were many other = divers on the same dive boat as I although they were all tourists and I = do not feel comfortable to buddy up with anyone whom I have not dived = with before. On the zenobia wreck their are fixed lines in many of the places = regularly penetrated, in all three car decks and one to the engine = room. I have seen only one place on the Zenobia where their is a line = fixed from end to end with the arrows you have mentioned but these = arrows are not spaced apart close enough. Over a space of 120m their = only three arrows. However I agree arrows would help a great deal when = vis is completely lost. In my experience on Zenobia I have always know that a penetration to = the engine room, the most difficult penetration on this wreck which lays = on its port side and starts at 18m and drops to 41m, can only be safely = performed with a maximum of three divers at one time because as you = enter the narrow passageway leading to engine room rust begins to = rapidly fall around you destroying vis within minutes. In your email you stated that you know of no reason to deploy my own = line when one is already present. My understanding is that I should never trust an existing line and = always deploy my own. However in this situation I trusted the existing = line because I have followed it a number of times. Besides its a thicker = gauge line then the one on my reel and using it keeps my hands free from = using my own. The only wrong thing is that this line doesn't have the = guiding arrows you spoke about and with loss of vis and disorientation = it was easy to become confused as to whether I was coming back to the = exit or heading to the engine room. Had I tied my own line this would not have been a problem. One question = I would like to ask the forum is that on a large wreck like this or even = in a cave with a large group of lets say 3 or four buddy teams, how many = lines should you lay ? One Line for each buddy team ? Or one line for = the whole team ?? I would say the latter incase buddy teams are split, but in a small = confined area such as an engine room where there are so many places to = get caught and tangled I think only one line in needed but then again I = would not want to be in an engine room on any boat at any depth with = such a large number of divers. Going back to my situation, once I had left the engine room and followed = the line back I had to pass through three hatches into different areas = of the ship, and it was the last one that led me to a small room, the = floor of the room is on my left side and its a large floor panel that = was removed in order to make access to the engine room possible. Coming = out of this hatch you are approximately 30 metres back into the lower = car deck but the light at the end of the tunnel is very visible once you = enter the lower car deck. Unfortunately the line does not come right = out of the hatch leading you into the lower car deck. You have to enter = the hatch and one inside the line is tied about 3m to the right of the = hatch. I don't know who originally put the line there but I have learnt that = this line needs to be relocated after what I experienced and brought = right out of the hatch and tied to one of the lorries inside the lower = car deck where daylight can be seen clearly up ahead. The guide arrows you spoke of would have helped me a great deal because = once I let go of the line to swim through the hatch I thought was right = beside me and obviously I had turned left instead of right I = immediately turned and grabbed the line again and this time I didn't = know if I was left side or right or if I had slipped up the line or = lower down it. Another question I like to ask this forum is about Narcosis. I used to = think breathing Nitrox reduces narcosis, this is obviously true for = Nitrogen Narcosis but Narcosis is still present from Oxygen isn't it ? This became more apparent to me recently when I dived with a superb = underwater photographer on this wreck who took many pictures of me and = my buddy during the dive. After when I saw the pictures I was amazed at = the detail he had captured using a wide angle lens and I couldn't = believe the things I could see in those pictures that I had never fully = realised during my 200 dives on this wreck. For any reader interested in studying this superb wreck in more detail = visit Manos's web page http://www.smiley.cy.net/cytech/index.html Regards Andre ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C2519D.BE15A4C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" = http-equiv=3DContent-Type> <META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2614.3500" name=3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hi Scot</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I want to answer your questions, = hopefully before=20 anyone else answers for me. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>First of all let me start by saying I = am trained up=20 to NAUI Technical and Extended Range. I have read many of the manuals = from GUE=20 and I guess read much of what is placed on the WKPP web = site.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I have made 300 notable dive many of = them on this=20 one wreck which I have spoken about which bottoms out at 41m or 120ft = approx for=20 you guys in US. Their are no noteable caves in Cyprus and unfortunately = I do not=20 think their is anyone over here qualified to give a cave specialty = course. I=20 have done the wreck specialty PADI for what its worth :) But other than = that I=20 have only my own experience and the knowledge I have learnt from other = well=20 trained divers who I have dived and learnt much from.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Most of my dives in the past year are = conducted=20 with twins using the Halcyon backplate and wings with Apex regulators = and long=20 hose etc. One small reel in my dry suit pocket and larger reel on my = rig. Two=20 lift bags and spare mask. Mix always Nitrox 28 or 30 mix and one stage = bottle=20 clipped to my rig with a 50/50.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>What I tried to point out to other = divers on the=20 list is that thinking to ones self I have dived many times on the = same=20 wreck and know it intimately does not mean you can become so complacent = as I=20 did. It was a week day dive and all my regular buddies were working and = I was=20 having a short holiday and wanted to dive so I felt my knowledge of = Zenobia=20 wreck was enough for me to dive it solo even though there were many = other divers=20 on the same dive boat as I although they were all tourists and I do not = feel=20 comfortable to buddy up with anyone whom I have not dived with=20 before.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>On the zenobia wreck their are fixed = lines in many=20 of the places regularly penetrated, in all three car decks and one = to the=20 engine room. I have seen only one place on the Zenobia where their is a = line=20 fixed from end to end with the arrows you have mentioned but these = arrows are=20 not spaced apart close enough. Over a space of 120m their only = three=20 arrows. However I agree arrows would help a great deal when vis is = completely=20 lost.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>In my experience on Zenobia I = have always=20 know that a penetration to the engine room, the most difficult = penetration on=20 this wreck which lays on its port side and starts at 18m and drops to = 41m, can=20 only be safely performed with a maximum of three divers at one time = because as=20 you enter the narrow passageway leading to engine room rust begins to = rapidly=20 fall around you destroying vis within minutes.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>In your email you stated that you know = of no reason=20 to deploy my own line when one is already present.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>My understanding is that I should never = trust an=20 existing line and always deploy my own. However in this situation I = trusted the=20 existing line because I have followed it a number of times. Besides its = a=20 thicker gauge line then the one on my reel and using it keeps my hands = free from=20 using my own. The only wrong thing is that this line doesn't have the = guiding=20 arrows you spoke about and with loss of vis and disorientation it = was easy=20 to become confused as to whether I was coming back to the exit or = heading to the=20 engine room.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Had I tied my own line this would not = have been a=20 problem. One question I would like to ask the forum is that on a = large=20 wreck like this or even in a cave with a large group of lets say 3 or = four buddy=20 teams, how many lines should you lay ? One Line for each buddy team ? Or = one=20 line for the whole team ??</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I would say the latter incase buddy = teams are=20 split, but in a small confined area such as an engine room where = there are=20 so many places to get caught and tangled I think only one line in needed = but=20 then again I would not want to be in an engine room on any boat at any = depth=20 with such a large number of divers.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Going back to my situation, once I had = left the=20 engine room and followed the line back I had to pass through three = hatches into=20 different areas of the ship, and it was the last one that led me to a = small=20 room, the floor of the room is on my left side and its a large = floor panel=20 that was removed in order to make access to the engine room possible. = Coming out=20 of this hatch you are approximately 30 metres back into the lower = car deck=20 but the light at the end of the tunnel is very visible once you enter = the lower=20 car deck. Unfortunately the line does not come right out of the = hatch=20 leading you into the lower car deck. You have to enter the hatch and one = inside=20 the line is tied about 3m to the right of the hatch.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I don't know who originally put the = line there but=20 I have learnt that this line needs to be relocated after what I = experienced=20 and brought right out of the hatch and tied to one of the lorries = inside=20 the lower car deck where daylight can be seen clearly up = ahead.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The guide arrows you spoke of would = have helped me=20 a great deal because once I let go of the line to swim through the hatch = I=20 thought was right beside me and obviously I had turned left = instead=20 of right I immediately turned and grabbed the line again and this time I = didn't=20 know if I was left side or right or if I had slipped up the line = or lower=20 down it.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Another question I like to ask this = forum is about=20 Narcosis. I used to think breathing Nitrox reduces narcosis, this is = obviously=20 true for Nitrogen Narcosis but Narcosis is still present from Oxygen = isn't it=20 ?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>This became more apparent to me = recently when I=20 dived with a superb underwater photographer on this wreck who took many = pictures=20 of me and my buddy during the dive. After when I saw the pictures I was = amazed=20 at the detail he had captured using a wide angle lens and I couldn't = believe the=20 things I could see in those pictures that I had never fully = realised=20 during my 200 dives on this wreck.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For any reader interested in studying = this superb=20 wreck in more detail visit Manos's web page <A=20 href=3D"http://www.smiley.cy.net/cytech/index.html">http://www.smiley.cy.= net/cytech/index.html</A></FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Regards Andre</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML> ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C2519D.BE15A4C0-- -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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