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Marv, A set of 72s will let you leave that weightbelt at home and the tanks are about 10-12 pounds lighter. That way you can be twenty-something pounds lighter going up the ladder. The two downsides are a bit less capacity and virtual uselessness for wetsuit diving. Don ----- Original Message ----- From: marv <ajmarve@op*.ne*> To: deepdive <deepdive@xt*.co*.nz*> Cc: TECHDIVER <techdiver@aquanaut.com> Sent: 29 August, 2001 22:42 Subject: Re: FW: Silent Submersion Vs Dacor > 12 lbs belt, 6 lb plate, pro 6 canister w/ tls350 and c4. hiland bands > w/ sea elite manifold. luxfer standard 80. > > marv > > deepdive wrote: > > > Hey marv, > > Have you been raiding the scrap dealers for lead or what? > > As that's one helluva V-weight you're talking about...let alone > > slung on a weight belt. > > How much weight do you have to carry with your twin 80's in drysuit > > and ocean diving? > > Just curious... > > > > Paul Berry > > Southern Ocean Explorers > > DIR-N.Z. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: marv [mailto:ajmarve@op*.ne*] > > Sent: Wednesday, 29 August 2001 3:51 p.m. > > To: Jim Cobb > > Cc: terry michael; MHK; Michael J. Blitch; techdiver@aquanaut.com > > Subject: Re: Silent Submersion Vs Dacor > > > > > > JIm, > > > > I guess the difference lies in thinking about what one is doing. you > > seem content to ignore any variables in your dive and stumble blindly > > along hoping that you will have brought enuff of whatever. > > > > i could be wrong but this seems to be the antithesis of everything these > > florida guys preach. > > > > the plain fact is i am worried about your approach and its consequences. > > your recent post about brass fever was disconcerting to say the least. > > you may think i am just busting your ass for the sport of it, but > > frankly i am trying to help you see that there is a reason to consider > > each dive as a seperate exposure and to choose equipment accordingly > > with the dir principles in mind, instead of insisting on a one size fits > > all approach. > > > > I suspect that you have not even tried to experiment with smaller tanks, > > which while they require weight to compensate for their buoyancy are > > still less of a burden that the 104's. The fact is double 80s in a dry > > suit can be made to work quite easily and the result is a smaller > > cleaner rig that handles better overall, whether scootering or swimming. > > 160 cu ft of gas is sufficient for a single dive and you can get two > > sets of 80s for the price of one of 104's. a v weight can easly be used > > in place of a weight belt for those who would rathernot be bothered, > > although this does preclude the ditching of wt, like say if you need to > > flaot on the surface for a while waiting for the coasties. but even with > > a v wt the 80s arent going to be as heavy as empty 104s. JIm i didnt > > make this up, i got it all from George, who you folks seem to listen to > > very selectively. > > > > im not going to strain thu your last 100 posts about 80s, because > > frankly, who gives a fuck. what i would like is some admission on your > > part that you dont know enuff about double 80s to make the claim that > > 104s are better. > > > > marv > > > > Jim Cobb wrote: > > > >> Marv- > >> > >> First off I am not a cave diver. Second, you did not seem to get my point > >> that for wreck diving I consider your air supply to be a tad bit more > >> important than scooter battery life. In wreck diving you are given the > >> opportunity to change batteries which you don't have in a cave. You are > >> comparing apples to oranges. > >> > >> Thirdly I believe in diving the same rig on every dive regardless of the > >> depth. I don't see the point in wearing different tanks suit the > > > > particular > > > >> depths. This is BS. > >> > >> Also I don't understand what your harping about AL80's all about. If you > >> dive with a wetsuit 80's are fine. If you dive with a drysuit the negative > >> aspects of steel doubles help your buoyancy. The steel 104's happen to be > >> ideal for this purpose. > >> > >> I would like you to please repost where I said that double 80's were > >> inferior to steel 104 because they don't carry enough gas. What I may have > >> said is that having more gas than you need for a specific dive is not a > >> detriment to the dive. > >> > >> So please take your weird, ill thought out, disjointed, nonsenceical, out > > > > of > > > >> context post here and go back to your treadmill, which happens to go the > >> same destination as your argument. Nowhere. > >> > >> Jim > >> ------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> Learn About Trimix at http://www.cisatlantic.com/trimix/ > >> > >>> From: marv <ajmarve@op*.ne*> > >>> Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 02:11:07 -0400 > >>> To: terry michael <OEA51@go*.co*> > >>> Cc: Jim Cobb <cobber@ci*.co*>, MHK <mhkane@pr*.ne*>, "Michael > >> > > J. > > > >>> Blitch" <mblitch1@ta*.rr*.co*>, techdiver@aquanaut.com > >>> Subject: Re: Silent Submersion Vs Dacor > >>> > >>> JIm's thing< and its not just Jim, there is a small group now> is that > >>> the only tanks for drysuit is the double 104's. this is despite > >>> commentary from George himself that for ocean, you dont need all that > >>> gas even in a drysuit and that double 80s should be enuff for most of > >>> what one might attempt.< "for ocean the aluminum 80 is the tank of > >>> choice"> The rationale seems to be taught by most of your tek agencies > >>> that you can never have enuff gas because "you never know what is going > >>> to happen" and people find this more comforting to embrace than the fact > >>> that they need to exercise aerobically for diving. > >>> > >>> Personally i would suggest that you plan your dive and dive your plan, > >>> altering the plan only in the direction of being conservative during a > >>> dive. < i.e. less bottom time>. I would also suggest that if your going > >>> to carry a major reserve of one dive parameter<gas> you should have > >>> equvalent supply of any other<scooter/light burn>. > >>> > >>> Finally i would suggest that anyone who cant understand why huge tanks > >>> and a tiny scooter might not be a good idea should reread the last > >>> paragraph of Gavin's chapter and look in the mirror. > >>> > >>> marv > >>> > >>> ps i wear dbl 80s, drive a mako and set the treadmill on speed 8 at > >>> least once a day. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> terry michael wrote: > >>> > >>>> Are we talking about diving thirds here or what? This is a public list > >>> > > please > > > >>>> explain what you are trying to tell us. > >>> > >>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>> From: "marv"<ajmarve@op*.ne*> > >>>> To: "Jim Cobb"<cobber@ci*.co*> > >>>> Cc: "MHK"<mhkane@pr*.ne*>, "terry michael"<OEA51@go*.co*>, "Michael > >>> > > J. > > > >>>> Blitch"<mblitch1@ta*.rr*.co*>, techdiver@aquanaut.com > >>>> Date: Mon Aug 27 10:37:44 PDT 2001 > >>>> Subject: Re: Silent Submersion Vs Dacor > >>>> > >>>>> so what are you saying Jim, that you dont plan your dives or dont have > >>>>> the discipline to follow that plan ? > >>>>> > >>>>> you are on the right track with respect to less is best, you just need > >>>>> to take it all the way. > >>>>> > >>>>> marv > >>>>> > >>>>> Jim Cobb wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> Gas=Life. Is that real enough for you? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Jim > >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>>>> Learn About Trimix at http://www.cisatlantic.com/trimix/ > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> From: marv <ajmarve@op*.ne*> > >>>>>>> Date: Fri, 24 Aug 2001 18:11:57 -0400 > >>>>>>> To: Jim Cobb <cobber@ci*.co*> > >>>>>>> Cc: MHK <mhkane@pr*.ne*>, terry michael <OEA51@go*.co*>, "Michael > >>>>>> > > J. > > > >>>>>>> Blitch" <mblitch1@ta*.rr*.co*>, techdiver@aquanaut.com > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Silent Submersion Vs Dacor > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> and yet you doggedly defend the concept of carrying three times as > >>>>>> > > much > > > >>>>>>> gas as needed for a given dive< see any old dbl 80 vs 104 thread.> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Marv > >>>>>>> <keepin' it real, yo> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Jim Cobb wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> I would still like something smaller, don't see the point in > >>>>>>> > > carrying 2 > > > >>>>>>>> hours worth of burn time on a dive were your actual scooting time is > >>>>>>>> around > >>>>>>>> 20 minutes. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>> -- > >>>>>> Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > >>>>> > > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > >>>>>> Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > >>>>> > > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > >>>> ___________________________________________________ > >>>> GO.com Mail > >>>> Get Your Free, Private E-mail at http://mail.go.com > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > > > > -- > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > -- > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > > > -- > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > ---------------------------------------------------- NetZero Platinum Sign Up Today - Only $9.95 per month! http://my.netzero.net/s/signup?r=platinum&refcd=PT97 -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. 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