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Rikard - you have not seen a stroke until you have seen Zambeck and his "rig" - he makes Maffatone look slick. Funny that you Swedes dive DIR on wrecks through the ice, but the Great Lakes Strokes can 't figure this one out. Anything BUT for them. -----Original Message----- From: Richard Lundgren [mailto:rikard.lundgren@sw*.se*] Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2000 4:47 AM To: techdiver@aquanaut.com Cc: techdiver@aquanaut.com Subject: Re: Ice diving Ice diving is very similar to cave and overhead environment diving. Usually the most common difference is the water and surface temperature. But remember that a cave dive can be made in freezing condition to. This mail is not ment to be more than a overview, there are more to ice diving than I have had time to write. To do it the Padi way is well advised for those using regular sport diving equipment (no redundancy). Meaning tender line to the surface and between the divers. This line is used for line signals and as a guide line back to the hole in the ice. Using surface tenders and stand by divers is vital and should not be ignored. There are more practical steps to make this safe but I'm in a hurry... Doing it DIR is superior in cave, ice and any other environment and clams benefits from greater safety, productivity and ease of use. In a ice situation we go a head basically as heading into a cave. Using a guide line to the surface and deploy it as if it was a normal cave dive. Surface support and backup team is always a good thing. We do use dry gloves and are taking steps to prevent hypothermia. Apart from this minor adjustment we make no change at all to the equipment that you all recognize as DIR. The DIR concept has been proven ice worthy a long time ago and there are simply no need for radical adjustments. The most common recognized hazard during icy stuff is equipment failure due to the cold (hypothermia is a obvious risk for longer exposures). Only use regulators that are made for cold environments. Reduce the intermediate pressure (IP) if needed, check what the range of acceptable IPs are for your first stages. Do not use regulators prior to descending, this will prevent humidity to enter the regulator and thus cause a premature equipment failure. Do not inhale and over use the inflator at the same time, this will make the regulator deliver a unnecessarily high amount of cold gas thru the system. Be aware of the fact that every piece of equipment that delivers gas have a tendency to freeze if given the chance. This includes your inflator. If over used, the inflator will freeze and the result might be a rather scary uncontrolled ascend to the surface, or the ice which by the way is in the way of making you go sky high. There are steps to limit and prevent the effects of equipment failures but these have already been discussed on this list before. In short, educate, accumulate experience, use a proven system (DIR) and use your mind, good equipment and team mates. Have fun, get cold.. Oh, almost forgot. Mr Black might be willing to step in and tell us one ore two things about his Ice diving adventures. I have not forgotten about his master skills in this area and the nice (scary) pictures he referred to at that time. I'm eager debate with you doctor Frankenstein, have you been diagnosed yet and given the treatment you desperately need, in other words a new brain? uh!!! Take care, Richard Lundgren -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Fran: gzambeck1 [mailto:gzambeck1@me*.ne*] Skickat: den 25 oktober 2000 17:43 Till: CaptnDale@ao*.co* Kopia: Steven.Schultz@sp*.gc*.ca*; laocoon@et*.or*; techdiver@aquanaut.com Amne: Re: Ice diving Read Beneath the Crystal Ceiling by Todd Smith. Best book on Ice diving that I've read. Greg Z. CaptnDale@ao*.co* wrote: > In a message dated 10/21/00 9:29:34 PM EST, Trimixjoe writes: > > << If you ask the typical ice diving instructor (Being Ice Diving Instructor > Certified Myself) how to ice dive and what is the proper equipment to use for > ice diving, he/she will have you rigged for bungy jumping. Ice diving has had > very little written on the subject, and the procedures that are being used > today are limiting which are set up for nit-wit divers. As Instructors we not > allowed to step outside the standards it would be a violation. There are > better ways of ice diving then being used by the training agencies today and > it can help those already certified in ice diving to discuss over the > Internet better procedures, and equipment. >> > > I agree that some of the prodedures being recommended by the agencies are > stupid but I do not think they are dangerous. Unfortunately, some of the > prodeedures being recommended on the internet by persons who, obviously, have > little or no experience in this type of diving have the potential to create > dangerous situations. My point is that not everyone who posts in this forum > has a clue. Cave diving does not equal ice diving. If an instructor does > not think that he can adequately train his students within the standards of > his agency, he is bound, ethically, to go outside those standards. He needs > to exceed those standards, teach an unsanctioned course or find a different > agency. I repeat, if you want to learn to ice dive find an instructor you > trust who actually is an ice diver. > > Safe diving, > Dale > -- > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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