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As variation on the same theme, how about 28/35 as a "drop-in" replacement for air? It is good to 130 feet under any conditions a rec diver will see. The no stop times are longer than for air. The END at 130 feet is about 80 feet. The only downside is cost. Don Burke Chesapeake, Virginia ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Cobb Like I wrote in my post I do not discount proper training. And I also mentioned that you should be proficient in mixing nitrox before you attempt trimix. But I do submit that you could take a rec diver with 4 dives under his belt put a tank of 21/20 on his back and the only thing the diver would notice is a more enjoyable diving experience. I also submit that a large portion of panic attacks suffered by new divers is in part caused by the unfamiliar sensation of narcosis. Around here beginning divers regularly do their training dives in 90+ ft of cold, murky water, a prime environment for narcosis induced clusterfucks. On any given weekend you can see these new divers doing panic-stricken free ascents popping up like mushrooms all around the dive boat. Now these new divers should not mix their own trimix but perhaps trimix should be the REAL "safeair" (I still laugh my ass off when I see potentially toxic mixtures of nitrox labeled "safeair", what genius came up with that). Anyway I see your point that some people need training and hand-holding more than others and should be prepared to pay for it. Jim On Friday, October 6, 2000, at 06:46 AM, David B. Widen wrote: Jim You do not represent the typical diver. You do the research and reading before you jump in. Many of these people will just jump in. The reason for training is to ensure that at least some level of understanding and knowledge is in place. You are opening a door for people to use something they may not have the knowledge to use and get hurt. You know some of the same people I do. Would you want to turn some of those folk loose on trimix without them getting some guidance? So where is the line between the between those with enough good sense to doit with out training and those that need the training to get them on the right road and doing thing right. Trimix diving is technical diving. There is more to technical diving them just having the equipment, some O2, and in this case HE. David -----Original Message----- From: Jim Cobb [mailto:cobber@ci*.co*] Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2000 3:55 PM To: Paul Braunbehrens Cc: Mcinnis, Don; 'RDecker388@ao*.co*'; scottk@hc*.co*; techdiver@aquanaut.com Subject: RE: clarification was: An the beat goes on and on While I am not discounting the need for proper training, you don't need squat for certification to dive with trimix. I have yet to see a industrial gas supplier ask for a c-card for tanks of 02 and He. And as far as the the air tops are concerned it's pretty much a "don't ask, don't tell" policy at the dive shops I've visited. If your diveshop is an asshole about this, then it's time to move on. Personally I believe that if you are proficient at mixing nitrox and are currently mixing it on a regular basis, there is no reason one earth why you can't shitcan your nitrox wrist computer, get DecoPlanner for your laptop and go trimix diving. It ain't rocket science, folks. Jim On Wednesday, October 4, 2000, at 11:41 AM, Paul Braunbehrens wrote: No kidding! I'm doing it right now, adv. nitrox, stage deco and trimix just because I want to use He. It's actually ironic that you have to do a deco class to use trimix. It seems to me they are separate subjects. You won't get a fill without it though. Mcinnis, Don wrote: ~ >Bob, > >What's the prerequisite in shingles needed to get into it? Usually needed is >the advanced nitrox, decompression techniques, and then the "entry level >trimix" course at least. All this for being able to dive with a clear head >between 70 and 150'. Scott's point all along is there needs to be a "rec" >HOTx course with something like a nitrox C-card pre-req to open up He to >more people without having to go through 4 extra courses (not to mention >about $2000 or more) just to dive HOTx which is by definition relatively >shallow (less logistics) diving. -- Paul Braunbehrens mailto:Bakalite@ba*.co* http://www.daw-mac.com Mailing list for digital audio on the mac -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. _____NetZero Free Internet Access and Email______ http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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