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Don,

But of course you are right.  My apologies to everyone if my post appeared
crass and insensitive to friends and families of those on such lists.  My
vision of such a centralized, verified, and caring list was exactly what Don
so eloquently described below, w/ some unimportant differences on
implementation.  The time factor would appear to be the obstacle of momentum
here. Too much analysis on any single incident could impede posting of the
summary or synoptic message about that incident.  Perhaps the better way
would to post the encapsulation of the fatal incident, with a hyperlink to a
full analysis.  This way the list is easy to verify (before posting), easily
reviewed by many (once posted), and available for indepth analysis by
anyone. 

Steve Gerrad is working on a new book (as we write) detailing accident
analysis of cave diver incidents.  His previous book (Cenotes of the Riviera
Maya) had a few such reports at the end of the cave diving guideposts.  His
statement to me was the inordinate amount of time required to verify,
collaborate, etc.  I would expect a web site devoted to similar analysis
would also be long on postings and short on time.

Of course discretion and respect would be observed.  Death notices are
public notices, and permission to publicly post them is not required, but
anonymity of the victim can be observed in those cases where family does not
desire publicity.  The not so obvious intent of publicly posting such events
is to prevent further occurrences - the families must also understand this
too.  I maintain that a summary list (body count is a poor choice of words,
but got the initial point across) is needed in the dive community - both
recreational and technical.

Best Regards to All,

Quinn


Don Burke wrote: 
> I've been pondering the best way to go easy on the friends 
> and families of
> the persons involved while accomplishing the following goals:
> 
> 1. Extract meaningful training value from each incident.
> 
> 2. Ensure that each incident is not an "urban legend" and did actually
> happen.
> 
> 3. Eliminate duplication.
> 
> 4. Eliminate "prank" entries.  There are people who would 
> love to figure out
> a way to sneak George Irvine, Michael J. Black and many 
> others on this.  I
> don't want to entertain such foolishness.
> 
> My idea is to create a roll of incidents, by date and 
> location, with enough
> details to get the point across.
> 
> > Such a "Body Count" would be VERY helpful to the community 
> as a whole,
> IMHO.
> 
> As just a "body count", it is nearly useless.
> 
> As a roll of incidents with the names removed (but not 
> especially difficult
> to find out) and the pertinent details added, there is 
> signifigant training
> value.
> 
> > There is a Body Count site already, but it's focus is on 
> RB's and does not
> > appear to be updated recently
> 
> There are several sites around.  I've found a few and would 
> appreciate URLs
> for others.
> 
> The archives from:
> http://www.nytimes.com
> http://www.chicagotribune.com and
> http://www.pilotonline.com  (Norfolk, VA)
> have been tremendously helpful.
> 
> 
> > I'd sure like to see such "accountability" on the net.  
> Heck, submissions
> > can be made (after verification, of course) and updates 
> minimalized.  :-)
> 
> The roll as I found it had misspellings and no details at all.  The
> corrections and details are slowly coming out as I research 
> the stories I
> get from people on this list and various sites.
> 
> The original put some divers who made one mistake out of 
> ignorance (among
> hundreds of well researched decisions) in the same category 
> as divers who
> went for 500 feet on a single 80 filled with air.
> 
> Maybe I'm just getting sentimental in my old age, but I think 
> that is simply
> wrong and these men and women deserve considerably better.
> 
> 
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