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You are a liar. I am calling you out , you lying asshole. You are a lawyer, so sue me. Misinformation and lies do not cut it "Von" - everyone is sick of you , You lie, misdirect, obfuscate, twist and combine that with stupidity. Amentrout is an engineer and a long time serious diver - he can calculate his won deco, and does. He did not get bent from doing "my deco" you lying asshole. The dive he is discussing is a student dive, so what we have is students who can do what you can not, and again, this is not the point. The opiotn is you are recomending dangerous stupidity in a rig and are avoiding all common sense in the discussion there of. And, you are a liar. An outright sleezy liar. There is no reason for anyone on this list to believe anything you have ever said. All can see how far you will stoop to argue this lame anbd ridiculous point. You are dead wrong, and there is nobody who will puclicly agree with you. bigvon@be*.ne* wrote: > > Give it a rest George. If you want everyone on this list to believe that you guys > can make a 300 foot dive for 30 minutes SWIMMING on 76 cu ft of gas, that's ok > with me. And I am sure WE do not know how to deco too, so YOU can get by with a > forty of gas. (Even though I remember Jess saying he got skin bends from your > deco). > I do not think anyone on this list believes this total self serving bullshit. > Von > > kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: > > > Jess, if you and I are diving, and we need to do a longer bottom time, > > do we take stages, or do we convert our helium storage bottles to > > doubles and use them. I forgot? > > > > If you or I hit turn, do we call the dive or do we just keep diving > > until one of us runs out of gas ? I forgot on that one , too? > > > > If you and I did not actually do the dives we do, would it be ok for us > > to get on techdiver and lie about it, and make up all kinds of stories ( > > shark attack) and bullshit excuses about why we would not seem to know > > anything about what were discussing? > > > > > > Jess Armantrout wrote: > > > > > > see option 1 > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> > > > To: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*> > > > Cc: techdiver@aquanaut.com <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 3:12 PM > > > Subject: Re: its about going deep george > > > > > > >Jess That's great for you. Realistically how many of the multitude of tech > > > >divers out there breath a .25 on a swimming dive with stages? One can be > > > fit for > > > >diving with moderate regular exercise and does not have to maintain an > > > Olympic > > > >workout to dive.What if your buddy's rate was more than your own? How do > > > you > > > >calculate your safety? > > > >Von > > > > > > > >Jess Armantrout wrote: > > > > > > > >> I'm not a hoove. That is how I am safe. I run 40 miles a week, bike 100 > > > >> and swim 6. My breathing rate in warm salty water on weenie dives like > > > this > > > >> is less than .25, and the student's was much better than that. (We did > > > 100 > > > >> minutes at 50 on a night dive and she used 1300 psi out of an 80...what's > > > >> that, .13?). In a cave with steels and the additional task loading, my > > > rate > > > >> sky rockets to around .33, but that is scary diving. Also, we know how > > > to > > > >> deco, and don't spend all day. > > > >> > > > >> As I have mentioned to you previously, that you can not do these dives > > > does > > > >> not mean they can not be done safely. > > > >> > > > >> Jess > > > >> > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > > >> From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> > > > >> To: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>; techdiver@aquanaut.com > > > >> <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > > > >> Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 1:44 PM > > > >> Subject: Re: its about going deep george > > > >> > > > >> >Out of curiosity what was your mix and quantify for bottom gas and deco > > > >> gas? > > > >> >At 30 min there is significant deco at 300 feet. > > > >> >How do you bring enough gas to be safe? > > > >> > > > > >> >I just got back from Cayman and the temp was around 79 to 80 on the > > > bottom. > > > >> >I would be in a sweat box in a dry suit . > > > >> > > > > >> >Bill > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> >Jess Armantrout wrote: > > > >> > > > > >> >> Von, > > > >> >> you're grasping, buddy. I taught a trimix course in Cayman, several > > > >> years > > > >> >> ago, back when nitrox wasn't even legal there. We did 300's for 25 to > > > 30 > > > >> >> all week long. Ironically, my student was the safety officer for the > > > >> CIWA, > > > >> >> the organization banning Nitrox in Cayman. Since neither of us were > > > >> hooves, > > > >> >> we dove twin 80's and 40's for deco gas. We were swimming. We were > > > >> diving > > > >> >> wet. I dove a Halcyon 18 pound set of wings and no weight. > > > >> >> > > > >> >> WHAT'S THE BIG FUCKING DEAL!!!!????!!!!! > > > >> >> > > > >> >> -----Original Message----- > > > >> >> From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> > > > >> >> To: kirvine@sa*.ne* <kirvine@sa*.ne*> > > > >> >> Cc: gordonjr <jrgordonsenior@em*.ms*.co*>; techdiver@aquanaut.com > > > >> >> <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > > > >> >> Date: Tuesday, November 23, 1999 11:23 PM > > > >> >> Subject: Re: its about going deep george > > > >> >> > > > >> >> >Obviously George you have never made a deep dive in the summer in the > > > >> >> Caribbean > > > >> >> >or you would understand. > > > >> >> >You still have not posted your tank/gas configuration diving wet > > > w/out > > > >> >> scooter at > > > >> >> >300 much less 350, for 25 to 30 min.. > > > >> >> >What are you so afraid of? > > > >> >> >That there is an instant when DIR might not be exactly as the great > > > >> George > > > >> >> >Grapevine dictates? > > > >> >> >DIR does work in most instances. However there might, just might be > > > an > > > >> >> >alternative that is safer for the longer exposures at depth. i.e. > > > >> redundant > > > >> >> bc' > > > >> >> >for gas availability. > > > >> >> >By the way, studies have shown that one long exposure may be safer > > > than > > > >> two > > > >> >> >shorter ones. > > > >> >> >Von > > > >> >> >kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> >> Bill, you are not only dangerous ,you are an outright liar. There > > > is > > > >> no > > > >> >> >> ocean on this planet where the water at "350" is warm. The > > > Britannic > > > >> is > > > >> >> >> cold as would be expected at depth and warm at the surface as would > > > be > > > >> >> >> expected in the Mediteranean. Your original argument was that the > > > Gulf > > > >> >> >> is warm at the surface. The fact is you have no justification for > > > >> >> >> dangerous stupidity. > > > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> An unbalanced rig is open ocean the trademeark of a no-plan > > > >> dillatante. > > > >> >> >> This is so simple, and you do not get it. Convoluted stupidity to > > > >> offset > > > >> >> >> self-inflicted risk is not the answer. > > > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> I will keep offsetting your nonsense and pointing out how wrong you > > > >> are. > > > >> >> >> The difference betwen you and the guys who did the Britannic is the > > > >> >> >> diffrence between the real thing and bullshit. Jarrod is the real > > > >> thing, > > > >> >> >> you are a yapping pretender. > > > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> Your other argument is that we do not "know wreck diving". Well, > > > Big > > > >> >> >> Time, that is obviously not the case, and the fact is that it makes > > > no > > > >> >> >> difference where the dive is, our methods are used by the > > > successful > > > >> >> >> divers, the bullshit is what the bullshitters use. You are in the > > > >> latter > > > >> >> >> category. > > > >> >> >> > > > >> >> >> bigvon@be*.ne* wrote: > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> >> > Like I said before George you are a master of misdirection. The > > > >> >> discussion > > > >> >> >> > was about deep warm water diving with steels without the use of a > > > >> >> scooter.. > > > >> >> >> > Not cold Britannic water with drysuits and scooters. > > > >> >> >> > You still did not answer the question tough guy and I doubt you > > > ever > > > >> >> will. > > > >> >> >> > Von > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> >> > kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: > > > >> >> >> > > > > >> >> >> > > Von, why don't you stop by GUE and straighten Jarrod out. I > > > tried > > > >> to > > > >> >> >> > > tell him that diving the Britannic in a drysuit was not the Von > > > >> >> method, > > > >> >> >> > > and that since he was beyond 300, he should have had steels and > > > a > > > >> >> >> > > wetsuit, a backwards bc, two bottom timers in case his arm got > > > bit > > > >> >> off > > > >> >> >> > > by a shark, etc. > > > >> >> >> > > > > > >> >> >> > > Maybe you can come to a WKPP dive and tell me how to do more > > > than > > > >> a > > > >> >> >> > > "bounce" dive, since I have very little experience with the > > > kind > > > >> of > > > >> >> big > > > >> >> >> > > bottom times you are doing, and show me about "exploring" and > > > what > > > >> I > > > >> >> >> > > need to do in the way of "modifications " to accomplish these > > > >> feats, > > > >> >> >> > > short of the lobotomy is appears you forgot to tell us about. > > > >> >> >> > > > > > >> >> >> > > bigvon@be*.ne* wrote: > > > >> >> >> > > > > > > >> >> >> > > > I did laugh at THAT one. > > > >> >> >> > > > I realize I am on the "DIR list", not techdiver. I will > > > continue > > > >> to > > > >> >> >> > > > dive my way and you guys can stay above 300 and dive your > > > way. > > > >> No > > > >> >> one > > > >> >> >> > > > has addressed the deep issue. I am not advocating deep > > > diving, > > > >> just > > > >> >> >> > > > commenting on a style that is safe. You WKPP guys keep > > > bouncing > > > >> the > > > >> >> >> > > > wrecks and we will keep exploring them. > > > >> >> >> > > > Von > > > >> >> >> > > > > > > >> >> >> > > > gordonjr wrote: > > > >> >> >> > > > > > > >> >> >> > > > Von, You place your backup wing on upside down, strap > > > the > > > >> >> >> > > > inflator to your waist strap, and orally inflate at > > > waist > > > >> >> >> > > > level?Hell, if I could do that I'd never leave the house > > > >> >> >> > > > (credits to G.Carlin). JR Gordon "Just flip the BC > > > over > > > >> >> >> > > > and place it over the bolts as you do your primary B.C. > > > >> >> >> > > > I loop a small loop of small bungie over the bottom bolt > > > >> >> >> > > > before I assemble the > > > >> >> >> > > > harness. This loop is placed over the power inflator > > > >> >> >> > > > mechanism to secure it at > > > >> >> >> > > > your right waist. There is no hose run to the inflator. > > > >> Just > > > >> >> >> > > > orally inflate if > > > >> >> >> > > > needed." > > > >> >> >> > > > > > >> >> >> > > -- > > > >> >> >> > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > > > >> >> `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > >> >> >> > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > > > >> >> `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> >-- > > > >> >> >Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > > > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > >> >> >Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > > > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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