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Karen, Hell if your that worried about getting them out fast CUT IT (Shears/knife etc...) Try cutting a BC off...hell of alot easier to cut a 2" web then a boat load of other crap on a BC. Sean Cary ----- Original Message ----- From: <kirvine@sa*.ne*> To: Karen Nakamura <karen@gp*.co*> Cc: <techdiver@aquanaut.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 3:36 PM Subject: The Quick and the Dead Release was Re: DIR on RIB's > Karen, "with all due respect", if you rig the thing properly in the > first place, this is NOT and issue. It will come off quite easily. I am > also assuming that the diver is CORRECTLY weighted, and not in steel > tanks with a wetsuit which would imply the need to overinflate his bc > JUST to hold him afloat and therefore make it very hard to get the rig > off without a blowtorch, or that you know how to pop a neckseal to > relieve a blown-up drysuit. > > I am not talking idiots and strokes, I am talking people who have DIR'd > it from the get-go. I am not interested in how to manage a self-imposed > Charlie Foxtrot, or how to "fix" some ill-conceived mess. I also do not > carry a five gallon gas tank on the seat of my car in case I run out - I > generally put the gas in the main tank. > > I saw Jablonski take a drowned diver from 120 feet to the surface after > traversing 200 horizontal feet of overhead, STRIP his DIR ( 104's ) rig > from him and get him breathing on the surface with no problem. Bill Mee > and I blew him with oxygen straight from a reg ( I don't do "rescue > breaths" on puking victims , I use the reg and power inflate them). > > Karen, I do not have time to discuss why doing things like a goober is > stupid. Sorry. You screw up your whole rig with a Q/R, and be a stroke, > but we do not allow it in our game, and we do not have to. That part I > really like, and again, with all due respect, I just do not have time > for this right now. Do whatever you think is correct, and when that is > not cutting it, take the cotton out of your ears and look at the WHOLE > system and see what we see so clearly. > > WKPP is back diving, La Nina is making this possible, and for the next > three months that is all I have time for and all I care about. Talk to > me then, or call me on the phone if you really want to learn something. > If you just want to argue, do it away from me. I am not being a prick, I > am just focused on WKPP for now and do not care what the rest of the > world is doing at the moment, no matter how ridiculous it is. > > And I do mean you can call me anytime - I can tell you in seconds what > takes me a week to write and have it make a lot more sense in a lot more > detail. Otherwise I don't think you will hear much of anything out of > the US WKPP or GUE contingents right now with everyone scrambling to put > our projects back on track now that Leon Sinks, Wakulla and the rest are > clearing. > > By the way, Karen, Q/R's don't necessarily "fail", they get opened by > accident, and then you have a problem. What you have done is gravitated > to the lowest common denominator of diving, and are now trying to use > that to argue with me. That is not "abusive", it is self-abuse on your > part. Again, a Q/R is an solution to a self-imposed problem of some > other kind, that causes more problems of safety that multiply as the > cicumstances become more severe , and often preclude proper operation > and positioning of the rest of the gear, and in a nuctshell are the > trademark of a stroke - like having one of those tatoos that could only > have been gotten in a drunken stupor. You've seen those, right? That's > what you look like to me when I see a Q/R or other talisman or amulet of > abject stupidity and ignorance on somebody's dive gear. > > Call me if you want info, otherwise move on. I'm done until the water > goes dark again other than on my own list. There are tons of people on > here who know what they are talking about and have the logic perfect, > like Billy Williams for instance. He can articulate any of this a lot > better than I can, as can a lot of these guys. > > Let me just leave you with this - if the best in the game do it one way, > and the worst do it another, who are you going to want to get your info > from? The pros who do it and get the job done with extreme results, or > the yip-yappers who do jack? Consider your sources. > > Karen Nakamura wrote: > > > > George - > > > > With all due respect, I wonder if we can't continue this conversation a bit > > further. > > > > One aspect where open water diving differs from cave diving is the > > possibility of surfacing with an unconscious buddy far away from the boat or > > land. In the LGS rescue course I took, we learned how to quickly strip the > > unconscious diver of his/her gear and tow them in the do-si-do position back > > to safety (while possibly applying rescue breathing). > > > > In a cave and/or underwater, yes you can flip the BC over the unconscious > > diver's head, but in open water, the best option is to get them to the > > surface as quickly as possible in order to ascertain ABCs and proceed to > > rescue breathing if necessary. > > > > It's extremely difficult to strip a BC off an unconscious diver if they > > don't have quick-releases and/or they're wearing a dry suit. The standard > > method (without quick-releases) is to "chicken wing" their hands through the > > shoulder harness opening, but if they have dry glove cuffs on, this could be > > problematic. > > > > Could you give me examples where a quick release was more harm than help? I > > haven't heard of a quick release failing in the field, but you undoubtedly > > have more experience and would appreciate you sharing that with us. > > > > Karen Nakamura > > > > ps. nonabusive replies are always appreciated, as well. > > > > > Flip it off over your head forward - same for doubles, same for > > > anything, same for a regular BC, etc. Believe it or not, the basics > > > still work in diving when the word "tech" is used, and in fact, are what > > > keep you alive. > > > > > > A "quick release" on a harness is ridiculous. Not only is it a risk > > > while diving, it impedes correct placement of the rest of the gear. We > > > do not allow them on any dive gear used in any WKPP dives, if that tells > > > you anything. > > > > > > Any unnecesary convolution or accommodation to one percieved problem > > > while not considering the whole picture is an automatic reject. > > > -- > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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