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Ted wrote: > Charlie didn't die from not having a buddy going up the anchor line. and > Drowning will likely occur unless your buddy is able bring you to the surface and resuscitate you ?? -- John Taylor Marketing and Trading Systems CREDIT | FINANCIAL SUISSE | PRODUCTS * +852 2101 6927 (Office) * +852 9031 6395 (Mobile) * john.taylor@cs*.co*.uk* * live4diving@ho*.co* > -----Original Message----- > From: Ted Green [SMTP:scuba@md*.co*] > Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 1999 10:42 AM > To: kirvine@sa*.ne*; techdiver@aquanaut.com > Subject: Re: Air Pony and doubles > > > George, > Do you ever wonder why people don't follow what you preach > or are reluctant to post information on diving fatalities? It's because > they have to read crap from you in return for posting information. > > Charlie didn't die because he was diving the Doria. > Charlie didn't die because he was wearing a pony bottle. > Charlie didn't die from the wrong mix in any of his tanks. > Charlie didn't die from not having a buddy going up the anchor line. > > Charlie probably died from a CO2 hit. This death could have > happened just as easily in a cave in Florida swimming against an > out flow current, or doing a dive off Ft. Lauderdale trying to swim > against the Gulf Stream current. Obviously a buddy might have > been able to save him but there are certainly no guarantees. > George, why don't you direct your energy toward explaining the > increased risk of a CO2 hit from over exertion while wearing > doubles, stages, dry suit while trying to swim against a current? > Who knows, maybe you could prevent a future death by explaining > the cause, symptoms, and treatment for excessive CO2 build up! > On second thought, don't say anything. They are more likely > to listen to me because I'm not yelling at them. > > To the Techdiver Forum: > > There is a high probability that Charlie died as a result of a CO2 > hit which resulted in unconsciousness and finally drowning. > > When diving it is imperative not to over exert yourself for an > extended period of time. Excessive exertion such as swimming > against a current, combined with uncontrollable rapid shallow > breathing may indicate an excessive CO2 build in your body. If the > exertion is not halted immediately and breathing brought under > control, the diver may experience a CO2 hit which refers to > "blacking out". Drowning will likely occur unless your buddy is able > bring you to the surface and resuscitate you. > > Ted > > From: kirvine@sa*.ne* > > Mike, the only reason for using a pony is abject stupidity, and the > only reason they all skipped order it in their reports of the > accidents is that they do not want to hurt anyones' feelings. The > carnage will continueuntil the smart guys just say "NO" to the boat > monkees, and some of the worst boat monkess up there are the > most entrenched big shots - in ourworld they are called STROKES, > and in my opinion it is their stupidity that is accountable for the > death toll directly or indirectly. > > If I were doing what I do and recommending dangerous stupid > practices, I would be as criminal as these guys are. The only > difference is I know better, I learn, I recognize when I am wrong and > fix it, and I admit it and point it out. These half wits are incapable of > any of this. Boy , would I love to get some of these strokes in the > water to show them jsut how bad they really are, since people > dying around them does not have any impact. > > > From: <kirvine@sa*.ne*> > > > Ted, there has never been a manifold failure, and the mode of failure is > > to lose the knob with a freeflwoing reg and no isolator - solution is > > "buddy", a dirty word up there. > > > > The ari pony or any pony is so stupid and so ridicoulous as to not > > merrit anything but laugter, if it were not for the track record at > > hand. > > > > I dive further into caves than most of these wrecks are offshore, and I > > have no pony bottle - that is patently absurd. If they are scared, and > > do not trust the buddy, maybe they need to carry a buddy bottle of > > proper mix as a stage, but this is also total bullshit. They need to > > start doing it right. > > > > Secondly, these guys have bullshit rigs and do not know how to operate > > as buddies, and that is why the are having problems. Quit defending > > these morons. You are in the business, and it is your ass they are > > kicking , not mine. I dive wherever and whenever I want no matter how > > badly the rest of the world screws up, as evidenced by the fact that > > they let us back into Wakulla after the Stone Fiasco, and they asked > > Jarrod to come do the Britannic. > > > > Ted ,these guys are idiots - they need a wakeup call, and obviously no > > number of deaths is going to do the trick. They need to get banned from > > diving out there to make the point. > > > > > > Ted Green wrote: > > > > > > George, > > > While I am not a proponent of this practise, divers who put a > 30 > > > or 40 cuft. pony on the back of their doubles, do so to have a > > > completely independent source of gas. The reason for this they > > > claim is that if you strike the isolator and break the manifold > > > causing a rapid gas loss, there probably will not be a knob left to > > > close the isolator down with. This practice is a hold over from > > > single outlet doubles. > > > > > > As to the cause of Charlie's death; I talked to one of the mates > > > on the boat a week after Charlie's death. He said that Charlie had > > > lost the travel line that runs from the point of entry to the anchor > > > line. Instead of surfacing and regaining the line, he swam against > > > the current to the anchor line and had to let go of the anchor line > > > several times on his descent to go around divers hanging on the > > > line. The mate felt that Charlie over exerted himself trying to catch > > > up to one of his two buddies and swimming against the current. By > > > the time he reached 165', he may have had a massive CO2 > > > headache. He signalled to his buddies he was aborting the dive, > > > and blackout on the way up. > > > > > > While all the crap that has been posted over the last few weeks > > > may have been possible. I believe that a CO2 hit is a more likely > > > explanation for him aborting the dive at 165' and blacking out on the > > > way up. > > > > > > Ted > > > > > > From: <kirvine@sa*.ne*> > > > Subject: Re: Petting the Air Pony: was Re: Doria Deaths > - Let's dive some air > > > > > > > > > > Maybe also we could get one of the rocket scientist up there to tell > us > > > > why ponying a bottle behind your back with the bottle turned on with > the > > > > reg over your shoulder mixed in with the other two makes any sense, > and > > > > why trying to combine a totally unnecessary bailout, a suit > inflation, > > > > and a travel gas all in one where the gas in question, AIR, is not > the > > > > right gas for any of those applications, and why it is a good idea > to > > > > put a reg on an inflation bottle , why we need a pony with a dual > port > > > > manifold, why we need it behind us, why it should be AIR, and why > nobody > > > > up there has ever bothered to question any of this nonsense. > > > > > > -- > > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > -- > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > > -- > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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