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Hi Stuart >In the sixties everybody used tanks with reserve valves and no pressure >gauges with quite good safety results too. Superficially they work well, >but what of the internal damage they cause? In the last couple of years >there has been evidence of lesions and nerve damage in divers coming to >light. I'm not aware of those evidences, do you have references, please? > Haldanean theory, which Buehlmann is based on, is a century old, and >in the last ten years we have learned that there are better ways. The last thread about Zplan seems to prove not so many rely on the better ways, though... >Try Bruce Wienke's paper on the subject. I'll read it. Thanks for the info. As for the >drysuit question -- ever tried argon? Does no-one weld in Egypt? No need for a dry suit here, and air temperature wouldn't make their use very comfortable. >Slowing your ascent from intermediate depths is almost the same as deep >stops. Deep stops are more effective. Why not use them? OK. I admit that I virtually use them when I do a slow ascent from 50M, and more exactly when I do any more challenging dive. I don't mind being wrong, if you're always right you never learn. But before I believe someone who goes against the mainstream and my own experience, I must check seriously, specially if the theoretical and empirical back-up is slim. And whenever someone shouts at me... I think he doesn't have enough arguments to convince. Regards. Hugo. -----Message d'origine----- De : Stuart Morrison <divebimbo@li*.fr*.co*.uk*> À : Bartolucci, Ivan Jorge <ibartolucci@wa*.fr*> Cc : TechDiver <TechDiver@aquanaut.com> Date : jeudi 10 juin 1999 01:13 Objet : Re: Hugo's contribution >> Haldanean models seem to work not so bad, as virtually everybody still >uses >> them with quite good safety results. > >In the sixties everybody used tanks with reserve valves and no pressure >gauges with quite good safety results too. Superficially they work well, >but what of the internal damage they cause? In the last couple of years >there has been evidence of lesions and nerve damage in divers coming to >light. Haldanean theory, which Buehlmann is based on, is a century old, and >in the last ten years we have learned that there are better ways. > >> I'm interested in that VPM model, where can I get more information? > >Try Bruce Wienke's paper on the subject. > >> I use Pyle stops everytime I do Tx dives. I've never done any Tx dive >> without them, so I actually can't tell the difference. >> But in the case of that famous 50M/20mn air profile, I don't feel much >> difference, specially if you use a somewhat conservative deco profile. > >Again, latest research shows that stopping deeper is more conservative than >increasing shallow stops arbitrarily. In ten years maybe you will start to >feel different when bone necrosis puts you in a wheelchair. If you haven't >got bent first. > >> >> >Helium is a far friendlier gas than nitrogen too. >> >> I'm not sure He is that much friendlier if you fail to empty your >drysuit >> after a 54M dive, as it seems to happen. Probably the opposite as He >comes >> out of solution faster than N2. > >That's the very reason helium is friendlier -- it comes out of solution >more readily than N2 and tissues have a greater tolerance of it. As for the >drysuit question -- ever tried argon? Does no-one weld in Egypt? > >> >Why? MOD for EAN50 is 22m, EAN80 is 9m. Why do you need such an added >> >range? What kind of profile are you diving that the contingencies are >going >> >to push your first stop 13m deeper? I thought you didn't believe in deep >> >stops? Or is it so you can get in the water with no planning and do >> >whatever your computer says at the end of the dive? >> >> After the dive we're talking about, wouldn't a slow ascent with Nx50 >since >> 20M be acceptably safe? > >Slowing your ascent from intermediate depths is almost the same as deep >stops. Deep stops are more effective. Why not use them? > > > >> OK. Dive deep on air should stop as soon as you reach your limits, which >can >> be 30M to 60M depending on your training, experience, personnal >preference > >Old ground -- other people have said it better than I can. > >> and sensitivity. Use deep stops whenever they become useful, but don't >use >> heavy tools when unnecessary. > >Doing deep stops in no way is endangering your safety, nor adds to task >loading, stress, or causes any other problem other than accepting that you >are wrong. > >Regards, > >S > > > > > -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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