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Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1998 12:30:04 -0700
From: John Walker <techdive@ea*.ne*>
Organization: TechDive
To: techdiver@aquanaut.com
Subject: stop your lies and get on with it.
Billy you are either euphoric or a plain lier.  State the facts and
keep the BS lies of the list please. Some of the easily influenced by
believe you bull shit.

bdi wrote:

 Ten
> Instructors from one agency killed themselves in the
> last year.

 Who are the ten instrtuctors and what agency and what does this have to
due with me?

> The instructors from another agency presided over and
> contributed to another four training deaths. Neither
> agency has done ANYTHING about changing the standards
> to avoid these situations.

 Here again smart Billy. IANTD is in the process of changing their
standards once again but since you know nothing about nor have any
connections dive training, how would you know the facts?.

 And the result is it is
> statistically safer not to dive with a technical
> instructor. And all you can say is "no problem, what's
> all the fuss?"

 Statistically! Who's BS statistics are you refering too? I don't
believe theres such a set of statistics that would have any credit
towards them.
 

> John, unlike you, I don't give a toss about 'names'. You
> came on here, remember, and DEMANDED to know everyone's
> instructor status. You did a classic Foghorn Leghorn act.
> And your big problem is the fact that you STILL haven't
> noticed that while you are defending the current situation
> the agencies with 'fuck you jack' policies are screwing
> YOUR activity too. You're just part of the whitewash crew.

  You know Bill, I never demanded everyones instructor statis. I only
asked the couple of loud mouths who were slamming IANTD weather or not
they were instructors themselfs and weather or not they actually knew
anything about dive training. This should not be confused with weather
or not they are great divers. Again stick to the truth please.
  If you think that all I due is teach diving then your dead wrong. I am
a DIVER and have'nt had ANY full time diving career in 14 years. A
matter of fact I would have to say that in the last few years I've
taught very little because I so busy doing my own dives.

> Once more for Slow Johnny: Ten instructors from one agency
> killed themselves in the last twelve months - making errors
> of judgement they are supposed to teach others to avoid.
> Two more pre-arranged their students' deaths. These people
> didn't have the judgement required to teach judgement. How
> low are the agencies' standards?

  Sure, I'm slow at typing! Thats because I am a one finger typer who 
never had any need for it until I got a computor. And towards your ever
meaningless remark, you can teach people everything in the world to
someone Billy but who's responsibility is it in the long run that they
pay stick with and remember what you were taught. Thats one of the nice
things about all the multible training stages that IANTD has (unlike the
quick, spit them out attidude you presented to us) because it give the
instructor more time to burry more information into ones head. I am not
about to follow everyone I have taught around and police their diving
activities BUT, if I ever see any bad activities they better straighten
up before they dive with me or on my boat.
 

> You have no idea how I'm certified, or to what level. This is
> serious business Johnny, not a fucking guessing game.

 Well Billy than who was it? I believe it was one of your Ozzie freinds
that privatly wrote to me in your defense and verified this information.


> Johnny, pointing out the fact that there is a major flaw in
> the way the technical agencies are operating does not make
> one a rebel. TEN dead instructors and you say it's all right.
> The tech agencies aren't changing their standards to solve
> the problems. You say it's all right. In fact, when the WPB
> tragedy happened, you popped up on here and said not to blame
> the instructor, the students knew they could be killed, they'd
> signed the waiver. John, YOU are the problem.

 Who's guessing or lieing know billy.  Grant it there are some flaws in
technical diving not just in the training, and the community has been
working together since the early 60's to resolve accruing problems we
face. Some of the pioneers of our sport who's information we have feed
on and built on to for a while know. Billy speaking of names, do you
even know about Dick Williams, Hal Watts, Tom Mount, Frank Martz, Jim
Lockwood and of course Sheck Exley who was also a dive educator.
 You have also lied about me saying not to blaim the instructor. I said
nothing of the such or who's was to blaim. And yes they do sign waivers.

> Once more for the dummies: If they haven't got the experience,
> the agencies are at fault for letting them through to do those
> dives. If they haven't got the education, the agencies are at
> fault for not giving it to them. Real EDUCATION, that is.
> Got it yet?

 This is why there are a few extra step. In order to assist in
experience before getting in over their heads.
 

> Johnny, I don't trust you. You're not bright enough to be a
> technical instructor and you're a stooge and an apologist
> for the perpetrators of the string of incidents which is
> wrecking technical diving for all of us. You're as much the
> problem as they are.

 There you go with you rashionality again. I haven't had a single
accident with myself nor anyone diving with me in all of my 21 years as
a card carrying diver. Wheres the problem. maybe your making them up
too.
 Billy if we could get you and a couple others to stop your lieing
nonesense then maybe we would have the required room on this list to
talk of some constructive issues. 

  John
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