Just to clarify my position ( from Terry) of percentage protein and carbs,
Terry determines the maximum amount of protein per meal each person can
utilize, and then he determines how much carb they can consume before they
will begin to store fat from excess.  This, and their activity level will
set their percentages----It would not be appropriate to categorize this as
low carb or moderate carb, since this will varry a great deal from person to
person. And you are eating no more protein than you can ulitize per meal---
for most this will be less thn 30 grams of protein per meal--for many this
may be under 25 grams, and again, this varries with each individual.  Fat
intake stays as low as possible, to allow more rapid digestion, faster
metabolism, and more meals per day ( to allow faster revovery from
workouts---more muscle rebuilding, and a faster, much higher calorie burning
metabolism. Everything is designed to get you to burn calories faster and
faster.  As I have said repeatletdly, this form of diet will work with
spectacular results of the dieter is engaged in intense fitness training
with weights and aerobic, and if they drink the 2 gallons of water per day.
If they fail to drink the water, or fail to do the workouts, the whole
system breaks down, and will NOT work------if you want to dive a 300 foot
dive for 20 minutes, and you know you need O2, Nitrox, and trimix to do the
dive, and decide to omitt the trimix as inconveniant ---you will crash and
burn on your 300 foot dive------the dieter who omitts his water or workouts
will crash and burn just as certainly.

Regards,
Dan



>To the list I apologize if my post on diet have offended some of you, I
will
>let it go following this response , but I'm offended at Ken for stating I
>have endorsed a diet of 90% protein and 10% fat. I have not and even the
>diets that I have referred to do not(except for three weeks on the power
>protein plan for those needing to drop a lot of weight, and these are
>usually people who have been unable to lose weight on other diets
especially
>the low fat craze that is in the USA)
>
>Ken
>
>I have been going back through all  the various post I have made on the
list
>and fail to see where I have ever stated one should do a 90% protein diet
>and 10% carbs.
>
>I have referenced to hi protein plans and stated they were not exactly what
>I follow, I have on a couple of occasions even posted some of my meals for
a
>few days, if you read what I write and I think you do not, you would see my
>grams of carbs or adequate but I still do high protein and more fat than
>most diets out there recommend. At the end of this post I will give some of
>my daily percentages of fat, carbs and protein.
>I referenced the zone and this is its base:
>Protein 30 percent
>Carbs 40 percent
>Fat 30 percent
>So this first diet did not do a 90% protein and 10% fat
>I recommended reading the power Protein Plan
>It’s maintenance diet recommends
>Combined fat and protein 60%
>Veggies, fruit and other carbs 40%
>It does include three weeks of drastic reduction in carbs for the first
>three weeks (for those seeking to lose significant pounds)
>First week no more than 15 to 20 grams of carbohydrates
>Second week no more than 20 to 25 grams of carbohydrates
>third week no more than 25 to 30 grams of carbohydrates
>after the third week KEEP ADDING GRAMS OF CARBOHYDRATES UNTIL:( Ken I think
>you overlooked this part)
>1. you stop losing weight
>2. Begin to experience fluid retention
>3. See a slight rise in triglycerides
>at that point go back to the previous weeks diet
>ONE OF THE THINGS I LIKE ABOUT THIS DIET IS IT ALLOWS A PERSON TO CUSTOM
>TAILOR A DIET THAT IS MORE IDEAL FOR THEM. IT IS MORE INVOLVED IN TYPES OF
>FOOD THAN IN CALORIES.  The carbs then on the maintenance diet will depend
>on the individuals personal response and physiology it may be the 40% carbs
>recommended in there maintenance diet, or it may be higher or it may be
>lower all according to the individual, I do not see where this is such a
bad
>method of allowing someone to obtain a personal best diet.
>FOR THOSE WHO ARE CONSIDERABLY OVERWEIGHT AND HAVE NOT HAD LUCK WITH OTHER
>DIETS AND JUST KEEP GAINING WEIGHT OR LOSING AND GAINING ALL THE TIME THIS
>TO ME SOUNDS MUCH HEALTHIER THAN GETTING BIGGER AND BIGGER OR THAN RAPID
>LOSS AND RAPID GAIN OF WEIIGHT, AT LEAST THEY DO ACHIEVE A DIET THAT WILL
>ALLOW THEM TO MAINTAIN THEIR BODYWEIGHT WHERE THEY DECIDE FOR IT TO BE. THE
>PROGRAM STATES MEN TO GET DOWN TO UNDER 20% BODY FAT AND WOMEN I THINK 22%.
>IT RECOMMENDS EVEN LESS BODY FAT
>Each of us will on this type of regiment arrive at a different value of
fats
>, protein, and carbohydrates based on our exercise levels and our personal
>physiology.It also includes that they should incoporate weight lifting into
>their schedule.
>
>KEN I CAN SEE THAT BY JUST TAKING THE THREE WEEK REGIME THAT THEY RECOMMEND
>FOR WEIGHT LOSS THAT YOU WOULD CONSIDER THIS AS AN UNSAFE DIET. IF IT WAS
>THE MAINTANCE DIET I WOULD AGREE WITH YOU 100%.
>
>Following are Reprints of highlights of the post I have made and
>
>Ken where do I recommend a diet of 90% protein and 10% carbs???
>
>I have an opinion that each person responds differently to
>various diets. So a diet has to be tailored to each person for optimum
>results just as does a training program.
>In my case I respond best to a diet that is high protein low to moderate
>carbs and moderate fat. Regardless of the source of the food. I love
veggies
>but on the times I have gone the veggie route, my endurance dropped and
when
>I was doing marathons so did my times.
>For me I eat a moderate amount of veggies and I have red meat two times a
>week, fish a couple of times a week and chicken a couple of times a week.
>This type diet provides me with a lot of energy and allows by body fat to
>stay where I feel comfortable with it. My cholerstol is actually to low, my
>BP is 120 70 and resting pulse at 45 at 60 this is not to bad, so I think
my
>diet and exercis routines are ok anything can be approved. But hi carbs and
>me do not mix well(my grams of carbs a day is upthere but compared to
>protein etc it is well below the 60% on the USDA fatten the pigs diet)
> On protein I use a Whey supplement (17gm protein and 2 gm carb)
>My typical workouts are
>
>Mon. run 4 miles at a 7 minute a mile pace, teach karate 1 1/2 hours at
high
>intensity swim dogs (play) for 20 minutes
>
>Tuesday lift weights are do a workout on a total gym, cycle for one hour
>
>Wednesday rollerbalde one hour, teach karate 1 1/2 hours
>
>Thursday run again
>
>Friday lift weights and teach karate 1 1/2 hours
>
>Saturday cycle 1 1/2 hours
>
>Sunday rollerblade 1 hour and swim dogs for 30 minutes
>
>add to this random time on stairmaster (for survival training 40 minutes
and
>800 floors), cyclone, healthrider, airofit, cross climber and time works
>machine.
>
>1. Good nutrition is possible on either a meat or vegan diet; both take
>careful planning to ensure the quality of the food. In meats as JJ stated
>there are so many additives (steroids etc.). that you must be careful where
>you purchase the meat. On veggies much of the soil is so depleted and the
>types of fertilizer so dangerous that its food value is debatable. ( Billy
>Deans almost died two years ago from strawberries due to the fertilizer
used
>on them, these were California strawberries and there was a health warning
>issued in regards to them) Thus just as in meat you must be careful where
>you buy them. Even organic grown products are not always healthy.
>2. Because of processing to insure adequate vitamins, minerals amino acids
>etc. it is necessary to use supplements if you are to ensure you are
getting
>proper nutrition. Again you cannot just go to the local supermarket and get
>a supplement and be assured your body can use it. many supplements are
junk.
>So again you have to research out what supplements (manufactures etc) are
>useable. Natural vitamins tend to be better sources than synthetic ones.
>3. All calories are not equal. Those wishing to lose weight frequently go
>into extreme low fat high carb diets. Protein around 15%. Guess what since
>this type diet has become popular we have developed far more fat people in
>the USA especially.
>TO FATTEN A PIG A DIET OF 61% CARBS, 29% FAT AND 10 to 14% PROTEIN IS
>RECOMMENDED BY THE USDA.(funny isn't it that this is the same they
recommend
>for humans as normal except protein is 14% carbs are 60%. SO HOW CAN
SOMEONE
>HOPE NOT TO GAIN WEIGHT IF THEY FOLLOW A SIMILAR DIET?
>4. We should eat carbs, no doubt about that. However as far as living is
>concerned a person can live with out any carbs in their diet, You cannot
>live without fat, and you cannot live without protein. Your body has the
>ability to convert fat or protein to glucose.
>5. WE SHOULD GET OUR CARBS IN THE FORM OF FRUITS, COLORFUL VEGGIES, GREENS
>ETC FOR THE VITAMINS AND CANCER FIGHTING INGREDIENTS.
>6. YOUR ACTIVITY LEVEL HAS A LOT TO DO WITH HOW MUCH OF EACH CATEGORY YOU
>NEED. Also each individual responds differently to different diets,
>nutrition practices, used either to gain or lose weight) I think Terry as a
>trainer and nutrition advisor will agree with this statement. On protein if
>you are active and want to optimize performance or strength you should
>ingest about 1 gm. of protein for every pound of lean body (muscle) mass.
>Carbs and fats is where the individual difference really flare up in how
>someone responds to a given diet plan.
>7. High carbs cause an immediate rapid rise in insulin and causes Glucagon
>to remain the same or actually fall. Many who follow hi carb diets
>experience a drastic energy fall off in a couple of hours and become quite
>hungry, frequently they desire more carbs (sugar) and when it is not used
in
>exercise it converts to fat. The person may starve them selves and still
>gain weight. Other individuals do well on hi carb diets. I for one do
better
>with less carbs.(in regards to percentage of calories per day)
>8. High protein diets keep the metabolic rate high, it satisfies the
>appetite and it preserves lean body mass. If followed correctly a high
>protein diet will produce Lower Cholesterol, more HDL, lower triglcerdies,
>reduces (yes-reduced) risk of heart disease, lower blood pressure and a
>stable blood sugar level.
>9 A high fat diet may produce dramatic weight loss but it may also cause a
>decrease in muscle mass, strength and endurance. However fat is essential
>for energy and is essential for safe health. the zero fat diets that so
many
>strive for in the USA is dangerous.
>10. SO ACCORDING TO YOUR INDIVIDUAL PHYSIOLOGY AND RESPONSE TO NUTRITION,
>YOU MAY WISH TO UNDER SUPERVISION EXPERIMENT WITH DIFFERENT DIETS. I FIND
>THAT HAVING MY TOTAL CARBS 15% THEN PLUS FRUIT, FIBER, AND VEGETABLES
AROUND
>30 TO 40% (total carbs)WITH FAT AROUND 20 TO 25% ( SHOULD NEVER BE LESS
THAN
>10% OR MORE THAN 30%) AND PROTEIN FOR THE BALANCE. TO LOSE WEIGHT I UP THE
>PROTEIN
>TO 60% AND CUT THE CARBS BACK. I KEEP THE SAME FAT CONTENT.
>11. You can follow the same type diet as either a veggie or meat eater. If
>you research it out (non meat manufacture research) you will discover that
>red meat up to three times a week has benefit, but more than 3 times a week
>is additive to cancer and other health related problems. As a meat eater I
>do red meat about two times a week, fish once or twice, and chicken once or
>twice. Various beans and nuts make up other ways to get protein plus
>supplements. To make this effective you should eat at least 4 times a day
or
>as Dan has posted as often as 6 times a day. Sounds funny eat more often
and
>enjoy a more stable body weight but it is true. We could write volumes on
>how your body starts into what it sees as starvation after too long a break
>in between meals or when on a low calories diet. It actually produces fat
to
>preserve itself under these conditions.
>
>There are a lot of good resources to read on diet and the effects of food
on
>the body and the effects of protein, fat and carbs .
>
>but for most it would be prudent to take the trouble to sit-down with a
>really knowledgeable professional (most definitely not the average MD, but
>if you find an MD who is into nutrition they are quite often an excellent
>consultant) and design a personal diet. It may change your life style. A
>good nutrition consultant will also insist you workout and will more than
>likely have you do resistance training to build muscle and burn more
>calories plus a CV program for your overall health.
>Tom
>
>If you follow a zone type diet you should be ok as it is not a high fat
diet
>with a lot of water weight loss other than in the first week nor does it
>eliminate carbs, and only then if you fail to supplement with potassium. I
>actually use a higher protein and lower carb intake. The zone basically is
>40% carbs 30% protein and 30 %fat
> The protein power plan advocates 60% proteins and good quality fats, about
>25% veggies and fruits and 15 % other carbs.
>
>So I recommended 1 gram Vs .9 gm for an athlete and 0.5 gm for no athletes.
>Based on lean body mass (muscle) weight not total weight
>if some one weighs lean body mass weight that is not total bodyweight that
>means at 1gm per pound a daily intake of
>My post 170 gm protein (a lot)
>At 0.9 it is 153 gm That is perfectly doable
>at .5 it is 85 gm
>
>I personally plan to sit down with Terry and discuss my diet and exercise
>routines as although I know my body and I have trained for my entire life,
I
>can always learn from someone who does this as a profession.
>
>Ken
>Whoa, where have I ever stated or implied that carbs should be less than
>10%. Do you actually read what I post?
>I did state for those wanting to lose weight that the power protein plan
did
>the first week with only 10% carbs( as I 'm not trying to lose weight this
>is not what Patti and I do but we are losing inches in the right places)
>Note in the following weeks they have you increase the carbs
>What I do is not there plan nor the zones exactly but more similar to the
>protein power plan
>As I have stated about three times I do not know what the Atkins diet
>requires. I think it is strictly a weight loss diet, which is not my
>interest?
>I will challenge you to drop your protein from the 40% you stated to 20%
and
>replace it with strictly carbs and keep your same level of activity and bet
>you a steak dinner your waist measurement will go up.
>Also the books I recommend list a whole series of articles and papers so
>why should I just duplicate that.
>Ken
>Read the damn post where have I ever stated a diet of 90% protein and fat,
>read all the post I have put out including the one you just responded to
>where do you get the 90% protein and fat .I agree that would be stupid and
I
>have not even once suggested such a thing. Open you eyes and read the post.
>Lets see the power protein plan would have a pyramid for the average person
>on a(average) maintenance diet of 60% combined fats and protein the other
>40% of (some will have less carbs and some more depending on their
>individual reactions to the diet and the carbs need for maintance)calories
>in the diet would come from fruits, veggies, grains i.e.. carbs
>This is a good diet for me,
>KEN from your early post where you stated you do
>40% protein it must be close to the same diet you do.
>
>Again as I orginally started out in saying People are different and
respoind
>to different types of diets, each person who has an interest in this area
>should experiment under supervision until they arrive at the ideal personal
>diet for them selves.
>Tom
>
>-----Original Message-----
>
>

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