Mailing List Archive

Mailing List: techdiver

Banner Advert

Message Display

From: CHK BOONE <CHKBOONE@ao*.co*>
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 1998 18:50:55 EST
To: techdiver@aquanaut.com
Subject: Re: Frozen Bondage Wings
Organization: AOL (http://www.aol.com)
I have been following some of this thread and wanted to contribute these 
 ideas:

1. 'Bondage' wings were primarily designed to keep the wing in close to 
prevent puncture while encountering sharp restrictions, such as 
encountered while wreck penetrating. I do not know that drag, quick and 
any position dumping, and slower inflation were major design 
considerations.

**Well, they don't stay very close compared to other designs though I'm sure
you're right in that it was at least a deliberate design feature and certainly
touted as an advantage - just doesn't cut the bill very well.  Just look at
the volume when deflated just because of the mass of material.    I can't
really say what was in anyone's mind when they put it together.   It just
seemed reasonable that the power deflation would be a major point since it is
a far more successful benifit than any attempt to hold them in close for
protection seems to have been.   Considering the nature of the kinds of snags
in a real wreck about the only place that is really safe from them is inside
the tank. 

**Actually Anthony is right about the slower inflation against the pressure of
the bands being marginally helpful till you get the bands stretched pretty
tight; I kind of threw that in just because it is there to some extent and
sometimes you gota take all you can get.
The small inflator orifice is the big thing on the issue of buying time to get
things under control.


2. The bungees that keep the wing in close do not facilitate dumping 
from a dump valve in any position. If anything the preasure of the water 
does that. Ditto for quick dumping.

**There is no pressure from the water.   The gas in the bladder is at ambient
pressure plus whatever is exerted by the bands.    With wings that have no
bands the air is simply held in a plastic bag that has no elasticity and the
only pressure exerted is that of buoyancy of the contained bubble upward.
This buoyancy is what forces the air out when you dump gas so that if you try
to do so while upside down so that the dump valve is at the bottom of the
bladder you will actually probably let water in rather than air out. 
   With the bondage wings the pressure on the contained gas will force it out
the lowest point just as if you were squeezing a grocery bag of air.   So you
can pull the dump valve on both the top and bottom and dump gas from both
simultaneously if desired, or just the top, or just the bottom, or the power
inflator without having to hold it higher than the bubble of contained gas.
(you will probably get a tiny bit of water coming in in some cases but nothing
worth mentioning)   

** If any of you shop owners have a low range gauge you can hook up to one of
these things it would be interesting to know just how much pressure is exerted
on the gas by these bands at a couple of points of inflation.   This could be
subtracted from the actual intermediate pressure to find the effective
intermediate pressure of inflation.

3. 'Bondage' wings and dual bladder wings neither contributed or bailed 
out the situation this particular diver was in. The second 
bladder/system is for failure of the primary bladder/system only. The 
bunges only keep the whole thing from going every which way.

** Not sure of what you're saying here.   Agreed that the same thing would
have happened with any wings since the source of the causative factor (stuck
inflator) and the inability to dump gas (iced valves) was diver error
regarding the disposition of a feature common to almost all buoyancy devices
(inflators and dump valves).   No particular design feature came into play
here because nothing was working.   However, if the dump valves had worked the
pressurized deflation would have bailed him out - but fast !   Much faster
than standard wings!    

4. Dual bladder wings are designed to be dove using the primary bladder 
first and in the event of any problem with that system, (the bladder 
tearing, inflator malfunction, reg shut down, etc.) the air is dumped 
out and the second bladder/system used. They were never designed to be 
used simultaneously.

** Exactly !   Definitely should not be used simultaneously !

5. If you have ice already formed in your gear from a previous dive and 
reenter the cold water it will take a long time for this water to melt 
the ice. Longer than most dives, including extreme ones. This is true 
for all really cold weather and water dives, ice diving or not.

** I would think you are probably right here and I defer to your first hand
experience.   
 

Tom

** Chuck Boone
--
Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.

Navigate by Author: [Previous] [Next] [Author Search Index]
Navigate by Subject: [Previous] [Next] [Subject Search Index]

[Send Reply] [Send Message with New Topic]

[Search Selection] [Mailing List Home] [Home]