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><< I am amazed at your ethics, that you would agree to these policys
when
> you, "personally", disagree with them >>
>
>
>Ummmmmm, Jammer, I'm an employee, not an owner.
Oh, sorry. I thought I was talking to someone who could actually make =
a difference.
Speaking as an employer, does your boss know that you are =
broadcasting his "policies", binding him to IANTD's policies =
publicly, and turning away customers?
I think not.
Another strike against your store. He hires employees who jabber on =
about policies that he sets without his presence.
>Many employees disagree
>with some or their employer's policies. Still, life goes on.
True. We agree. All of my employees wear safety harnesses on the =
roof, and the ones who squeek about it get to look for work.
><<This is a critical, life and death issue, but then, it's not your =
life, is
>it?>>
>
> If you want to make it a "life and death issue," the arguement may turn
>against you! A tank not properly marked *could* be mistakenly used beyond
>it's MOD....that would certainly be a life and death issue.
It's happened before, and it's happened to me.
It was just such an inciddent that served to set my views of this =
matter in stone.
I will attach the original post I made 18 months or so ago below.
> It's an unfortunate fact of our society that the lawyers dictate most
>business practices.
Ah, no, they don't.
At least, not for business owners.
Lawyers and insurance companies have no more power than you give =
them. Your store has surrendered without a fight, so it's true that =
at your address, the lawyers and insurance statisticians are in =
control.
It certainly isn't true at my company, or at the dive store I =
patronize.
><<It's because your dive shop isn't doing as well as it could be.>>
>
> Actually, we turn away divers wanting charter spaces daily....the boats
>are simply filled to capacity.
>
>
>
>Hmmmmmmmmmmm?
Oh, come on, Decker. Why aren't you rich? Why isn't your boss rich?
I didn't say you weren't doing WELL, Decker, I said you're not doing =
as well as you COULD be doing.
Because your loosing him business by what you say publicly, in his =
name.
He's losing himself business, both by his decisions, and his =
willingness to employ someone who runs his mouth about his store.
How do I know he's losing business? Because he's lost mine, as well =
as other, like minded divers here, and I'm sure, there.
Thus ends today's post.
Below is ther original story I posted to rec.scuba, along with one of =
the followup posts I made a couple days later.
-----
In article <424k6j$kr6@au*.au*.al*.co*>, =
zimmmt@au*.au*.al*.co* (Mike Zimmerman) wrote:
=80>>I am fully resisting
=80>>putting the large NITROX stickers on my tanks b/c we still
=80>>have head-up-their-a&& cahrater operations here that won't
=80>>let you on the boat with nitrox in your tanks (or even
=80>>21% nitrox aka air in your nitrox-marked tanks).
=80>
=80>This well and truly blows my mind. I assume that these are =
mostly boats
=80>going out to the U-Boat generated wrecks in the Gulf Stream? =
Have they
=80>said *why* they don't want you diving Evil Death Gas (our fond =
term for
=80>it around here :-)?
=80
=80Have you heard the phrase "get those damn cars off the road, you're
=80scaring the horses"? I dunno. Maybe they don't understand it. =
Maybe its
=80liability.
=80
=80>Other than that, I would think that the operators would be =
delighted to have
=80>their divers sucking less nitrogen...
=80
=80As would I.
=80
A story.
My Beloved and I were in British Columbia, diving the wreck of the =
Chaudiere.
For the occasion, we had brought with us two tanks each, one of 32% =
mix, and the other, 36%.
We have been resisting marking our tanks, in fear of the day we =
wanted air in them, and some dive store or resort operator refusing =
to fill dedicated, marked, nitrox tanks.
So our tanks were unmarked.
When the captain was asked by one of the divers which tank he should =
use, the captain replied
"Any of mine, they all have air in them."
The captain's tanks were all marked for nitrox. They contained air.
Our tanks were unmarked. They contained nitrox.
The diver looked around the back of the boat, saw eight tanks with =
nitrox stickers, and four tanks with no stickers.
He took 36% mix to 120 feet.
When I realized what had happened, I broke out in a cold sweat.
Everybody yelled at everybody else, and blame was spread evenly and =
thickly.
I yelled that if you use my tanks, you might die. Some of them don't =
even have any oxygen in them. He yelled that nitrox tanks MUST be =
marked. I yelled back like YOURS?
Anyway, that's what happened.
We were back up there last month, and the good captain has since =
removed all markings from any tanks that carry air, and is now TRUELY =
self rightous.
We still haven't marked our tanks, but I'm beginning to see their =
point.
If you use our tanks, you might die. It is my opinion that the final =
responsibility for what I breathe is mine, and mine alone, regardless =
of rentals, captains, tank markings, or any other "safety" device.
The rest of the world, however, does not hold this view, at least in =
this simplicity.
I don't dive with that captain any more, and I'm sure he's glad.
------
And the follow up I made two days later.
------
In article <CGH.95Sep4133631@ba*.ai*.mi*.ed*>, cgh@zu*.ai*.mi*.ed* =
(Carl Heinzl) wrote:
=80>Right. Sorry about that, I forgot that responsibility for your =
actions wasn't
=80>required in Canada. My appologies.
=80
=80I think the point the previous poster was is that it's not very =
good
=80technique to just grab any unmarked tank and dive with it. You =
should
=80know WHERE your tanks come from, whether YOU own them, or the boat =
is
=80supplying them. I do agree that it's careless to leave anything =
other
=80than air or normoxic nitrox lying around unmarked.
OK, stupid sniping aside, I originaly posted the story for two =
reasons:
1) It happened, and demonstrated (at least, to me) quite clearly what =
can go wrong on a charter boat.
2) There was a discussion in progress that I was watching with =
interest between two divers who didn't want to mark their tanks for =
nitrox, and the discussion was deteriorating into "I'm sure it's just =
another scheme to get money from us, what's the real purpose?" kind =
of thing.
So I posted a genuine, real life scenario to demonstrate what I =
thought THEN to be a good reason to mark all nitrox tanks.
I must say that the ensuing discussion has changed my mind completely.
I am returning to my primary philosophy, which, (to surprise the =
person who wrote the first quote above) is one of absolute personal =
responsibility. I recognize that this philosophy is not popular, =
either on this forum or in the U.S., but that makes no difference to =
me.
I consider myself a responsible diver, to wit:
I, and I alone, am responsible for my dives, and what happens to me =
during any phase of them.
There are no circumstances under which any other party, be it buddy, =
Captain, Divemaster, Observer or anyone else bears any responsibility =
for the results of my dives.
The gas I breathe at depth is, therefore, my responsibility, and no =
one elses.
This includes the mix, the origin, the tank, the valve, the first =
stage, the second stage, and anything I've forgotten.
If I tank multiple tanks to depth, and execute a gas switch during =
decompression, and I switch to the wrong tank, and breathe a mixture =
that kills me because of the depth I breathe it at, who is =
responsible?
The person/agency who filled the tank?
The person who marked the tank?
The LACK of marking on the tank?
Or am >I< responsible?
I offer another story, Canadian style:
I was diving off the Snowbird, a boat that used to charter out of =
Sechelt, British Columbia. (I believe it still does, but under =
another name.)
We had just completed my first dive on the Chaudiere, a deep wreck, =
(incidentally, the same wreck of my previous story). I was a very =
new diver at the time, and I was using unfamilliar equipment, a =
rental tank, a rental reg, I didn't own all of my gear yet.
Undisciplined as I was, when we reached the 15 foot stop on the rope, =
I was out of air.
The Divemaster had left a hang tank at fifteen feet, and so I =
switched to it, and started my safety stop.
There was a slight chop, and the boat was pitching slowly, maybe a =
foot up and down, and the Captain, a brave and brilliant soul, noted =
the change in the rope when I started using the hang tank, and =
observed that it was now catching on the bouy with every pitch.
So he started pulling on the hang tank, to pull it up, put it over =
the other side of the painter, and drop it down.I pulled back, really =
hard.
He pulled the tank out of my mouth, and hauled it up, and dropped it =
back down on the other side.
I put my reg back in my mouth, wanting one more breath, if it was =
there, and turned, in amazement, to my buddy, and pointed up at the =
boat, and drew my finger across my throat, saying that I was going to =
go up there and KILL him...
Of course, that's the out of air signal, and three octopi were =
crammed in my face, and I had a plethora of gas to breathe.
So, now, the question.
Whose responsiblility?
Mine, and mine alone. I ran out of gas.
Personal responsibility for the gas I breathe, under any =
circumstances.
There are no excuses for using my tanks. They are unique enough that =
I can pick them out of any group of tanks in the world.
I thank you for the discussion, it has renewed my faith in personal =
responsibility.
If you use my tanks, you might die.
---------
"Huh?"
--Jammer, 1992
---------
--
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