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At 01:34 PM 1/10/97 -0800, you wrote: >Subject:RE>>Question- Diving with A > >Jeoff > >> You have missed the whole point of the post between you and I. I >>have feed you information dealing with asthma, and you are still instanting >>that this person, or anyother person dive if they have asthma. > >I don't think so, please extract from my previous Emails where I say that this >guy and any other person with asthma can dive - at all times I have reponded >from my experinece, my conditions, my diving, what I have found On 1/8/97 GD posted the Following: "I have dived for five years with "mild asthma". - (I am triggered by infetions ie cold (don't dive), irritating inhalants - (not many in dive mixtures)" no where in this post did you not encourage him not to dive, if fact you were making the statement that for you it is all right, but you did not explain the fact that he should be checked out with a doctor, and also you didn't try to discouage him from doing the deep dives. You didn't say in that post what you went through to get cleared, all you said was "as for no doctor will pass an asthmatic fit for diving - they do in the UK - that included the mandatory chest xray aswell ( althought these are not done anymore as mandatory)". You made it sound as if all that happened what that you had a Chest X-ray, and that was it. I to this momment still don't know what you went through to be cleared, but you are the one that has to dive this way, and the only one at this time that knows! > >>Only someone >>with no clue on what the medical aspects of asthma would say or even suggest >>this. > >So now I'm clueless and so is the BSAC medical referee and the British Medical >proffesion as a whole Yes you are, I broke out the PDR, Egans Big Blue (the respiratory bible), the hyperbarics manual, (which in the chamber you are in a controled enviroment, whith 2 tech's and life support systems), made phone calls to 2 doctors that are in the area (pulmonoligist), do the physicals on divers in this area, also have a good back ground in diving themselfs. All you have done here is state what has happened to you. No information has been posted to support what you have said. It has all been hear say.. YOUR experance..... > >>Like I said be for, you do it your way over in the UK, and we will do it our >>way here in the states. I am NOT hiding behind what you call the "STD" >>liability statement, I am deailing in my relem of knowlege as a Respiratory >>Tech. you sir only state what is working for you, and you have no clue as >>to what you are talking about. > >Thats twice I'm clueless now - gosh it must be true ...... You may have a clue as to what your body goes through, what your limitaions are, and when an attact may come on, but as I just said, no proof has been posted to inform him as to what you have gone throug, just that YOUR experance, which just could put this person in jeopardy if he was to follow what advice you stated. As far as being clueless in medical terms, yes you are. Again, there has been nothing to back up what you say, or any referance to what you are talking about as far as being checked out. I have post on 2 different posts to you, some of the things that do look like asthma, but infact are not true asthma. >>The day that you can show me research that >>has been done on Astmatics diving, and giving the green light fro them to do >>it, then my way of thinking will change. > >That would be easier wouldn't it, however Life isn't always about research - you >dive ( I assume you use that PADI divemaster in the sig for something other than >making the sig way big) - what research was done on your body regarding gas >uptake and release ? Yes I do some research, being in the chamber on many occasions, I have see what it is like, and what is going on. Here is someing for you to ponder, you state that "Life isn't always about research", so that means that if Jim Bob comes up with a new drug, that there should be no research to make sure that it is safe, that it works, and that it will not harm someone, or cause more problems?? That is why things are tested over here, and not just put on the shelf for the consumer to take with out any thought. Another thought, is the WKPP not research? Is going to outerspace not research?? Life does include research no matter what you think.. Just about everything in life has been reseached, and is still being researced... And what the hell is this crack about PADI Divemaster?? What research was done on my body regarding uptake and release??? I am not in any research project at this time, But if I was offered this chance, would be more than happy to go and do this. But my plans are with in the next year to be on a permanent chamber team. This is my life studies, has been, and will be. > >>You still have not told me or the group how you came about to find out that >>you had astma, I have stated to you what all it took to determan if you had >>asthma or not, and all you can do is do the dance around the bushes! > >Can we have this again in a sensible sentence ? - but then why bother - it must >be right as I'm so clueless it didn't make sense at all to me, better take up >golf then - know anyone who wants aload of second hand trimix and cave kit ? OK, in a sensible sentence, better yet, tell us how you were diagnosed with mild Asthma. my point was you have only stated what happens to you, go into detail instead of beating around the bush. Put facts up to back yourself up. > >>Yes diving is a risk, as everyone well knows, And if a person is hit by DCI, >>then this person was diving out of his knowlege base, was exprmiting, outa >>shape, ect, ect, ect. I will not disagree with you in this... But if you >>are giving wrong information to a person, that may cause them harm, they you >>are guilty of not know a thing, and being a lamer!! > >Now I'm a lamer - gosh three names in one email and a great generalisation Yes you are a lamer, that is if you are giving incorect info, and do not state why you do this, and not "Just beacuse it works for me". You are talking about a persons life when you start taking about doing deep dives. You have to also keep in mind that 02 is corrosive to the lungs. Do you think that it would be alright for this person to dive if the lung function is only at 75%? But then maybe you were saying that you could do it, and that may after he was checked out and pass with the green light that he might be able to do it??? So maybe enlighten me on why you think it is allright for this to happen. > >>Your statements about being out of shape, smoking and alchol, diet, ect ect >>ect, well my suggestion to you is to be a test subject so as to find out all >>these answers. Granted yes we are all test subjects, but everything that >the >"general" diver does has been proven, and there has been research done. > >Are you expecting me to take up smoking , get out of shape, put on weight and >drink in the name of science - I'm afraid on that I will have to refuse .. > If that is what you want to do, go for it. You made this statement, "the bottom line is we just don't know or understand it all - what about smoking, alcohol, diet, stress, other drugs, ect ect" What I was stating, be a test subject for on of these, if you are wanting to know more about what the effects are, or go out and do your own research as gathering information on this, there are things out there that do state what is being done for research. Just like smoking/chemical damage = COPD, which causes air trapping in long term smokers, which in turn can give you a greater postibility of a PE (pulm emboli). So instead of makeing sound as I am telling you to get out of diving, rethink that statement that you made about going golfing, and selling you tanks. >Ps its etc not ect ;-) Thanks, heat of the battle I gess :> > >>Why >>do you think that there are dive table out there for us to use. They are >>proven to work for the averaged diver. > >Now I never questioned your knowledge - in fact I never questioned anything you >said - as I said earlier I have responded from what I do and what I have found >(maybe this is the start of that research on divers with Asthma you so badly >want me to point you to and now you ignoring the early results) - now for the >first time you have stepped away from talking about your specialisation and >mentioned something realated to diving and now I know you havn't a clue what >your taking about ! I am not asking for you to point me to research on divers with asthma, I know what some of the research is for divers with "True" asthma, and at this time in the US, it is suggested that they not do it. Once again the libility comes in to play, and with all the suite happy people in America, the doctors willnot let a person with true asthma dive. There are too many what if's, or this could, or who knows what could happen. Yes, we have made alot of strides towards understanding asthma as a whole, but it takes money, time, and the people to research what effects of being underpressure with Asthma. As far as me ignoring the early results, I have asked you to explain what process you have gone through to be diagnosed with asthma, and you still have yet to this time informed me, or explained the test that you have had done, and what the results were. So I am at haveing to take your word for it, which at this point doesn't weigh alot with this whole thing about the asthma. I can tell from the values that/if you give me, just what kind of asthma process you do have going on. Anyone can say that they have asthma, when in all reality, it may be bronchititis, or other disease processes going on. > >>All I can say to you Graeme, is this is getting old real quick like > >As for this getting boring - I agree - why post your reponse to the list ??????? >- I did as I'm clueless and know no better because all of my reply go to the list, unless it is posted privately. And all of this has been on the mail list!!!!!!! > >Have a nice day > >GD > Mail Address : graeme_davison@ne*.co*... You too :> *************************************** * Jeoff Freed * * aka Mr Lungs * * Orange City Fl * * www.totcon.com/users/lungs * * Home to the Wrecks of Broward * * PADI Divemaster * * Respiratory Therp (CRTT) * * A bad day Diving Beats a * * good day at work !! * * * ***************************************
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