Mailing List Archive

Mailing List: techdiver

Banner Advert

Message Display

From: Doug Chapman <doug@su*.su*.ne*>
To: "'toddl@in*.co*'" <toddl@in*.co*>
Cc: "'techdiver@terra.net'" <techdiver@terra.net>
Subject: Quarter-turn myth
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 07:28:56 -0400
The quarter-turn is no myth; it is a standard industrial and marine =
practice as already pointed out by Jim Cobb.  As Jim mentioned, some =
valves were designed with a "backseat" (not like a car) which sealed the =
packing materials from the system pressure and fluid.  In this case the =
valve was opened all the way against the basckseat.  These types of =
valves had their own special set of problems because of this, one of =
which was sticking.  A valve opened fully generally has the back of the =
valve "disk" against the housing. This can cause the valve to stick in =
this position if there is thermal differences within the valve and =
external to the valve (think steam) or due to the valve materials. The =
materials of construction of the valve stem and housing are generally =
different and have different coefficients of thermal expansion (i.e. one =
material would expand more than the other at the same temperature =
change). A valve turned back 1/4 of a turn eliminates this problem.

Thermal mismatch generally would not cause a scuba valve to stick open.  =
It would be more than likely due to the physical interaction of the =
parts in the valve being squished together.  Think about it, the valve =
mechanism is nothing more than a threaded nut and bolt arrangement, =
although it may not be readily obvious. When you crank the valve all the =
way open you are stretching the stem (same as preloading a nut and bolt) =
as a result of the applied axial force and modulus (stiffness) of the =
stem material. It may not be as easily to separate the parts when you =
try to close the valve due to surface friction between the two parts =
(remember the dynamic friction coefficient is generally lower than the =
static friction coefficient). 'May also have a bit of galling between =
the parts. A valve turned back 1/4 turn will eliminate this problem.

It is standard practice to check a valve position by turning in the =
closed direction rather than the open direction.  If the valve is =
closed, then checking it in the closed direction will do nothing (not =
let any fluid pass).  However if you check it in the open direction, =
then you will momentarily permit some fluid throught the valve.  Big no =
no! Valves do stick when they are cranked all the way open; its a fact =
of life. If one properly checks a valve open or closed by turning in the =
closed direction and it does not move because it is stuck, then he or =
she may be mislead into believing the valve is closed.  At this point he =
or she attempts to open the valve which is already open and sticks it =
harder or breaks off the stem. I can tell you a good story about this =
situation on a nuclear submarine just out of the Guam (did not involve =
the reactor).  A 1/4 turn from fully open eliminates this problem.

Some scuba valves (crap like the Catalina for example) have the stem =
o-ring "exposed" so that when you crank the valve open it "smashes" the =
o-ring. Do this enough times and your tank will leak (while I would not =
own one of these, I have repaired countless numbers). If this type of =
valve is fully opened and someone checks it by cranking open, well it =
will wear out quicker. Gently opening your valve fully and closing 1/4 =
turn will eliminate this problem.

And last, if your dive partner is too stupid to negotiate a valve =
position check involving checking in the closed direction, back fully, =
and then 1/4 turn closed again, then follow rule one, don't dive with =
the idiot. 'But then again there are a lot of idiots out there. I always =
tell my partners if they think my valves are not right when they check =
them then tell me before they make any command decisions on valve =
manipulations. I want to be part of the process. I have yet to have =
someone turn off my gas. 'But then again my partners don't get confused =
so easily. I also check all regulators after the valve checks but prior =
to submergence. In addition the 1/4 turn closed does not (for all =
practical purposes) affect the flow coefficient of the valve. The =
argument that it reduces the flow from the tank is senseless, has no =
practical basis because the valve is permitting alot more flow than the =
regulator.

As far as being confused as to the proper direction of closure in an =
emergency if it was 1/4 turn off of fully open, give up diving if you =
can't figure that one out. Why worry about it because you're dead =
anyways.  The people who tell you the 1/4 turn closed valve check is =
bullshit will also tell you the world rotates in the wrong direction. =
They would also tell you that teaching buddy breathing is not necessary =
since everyone has an octopus. So much for diver skill. =20

Of course this is just my opinion,
Doug Chapman

 

Navigate by Author: [Previous] [Next] [Author Search Index]
Navigate by Subject: [Previous] [Next] [Subject Search Index]

[Send Reply] [Send Message with New Topic]

[Search Selection] [Mailing List Home] [Home]