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Kevin, of course it's nothing new to them. Think about it, if you come down too hard on someone for violations, then they won't sell your c-cards and books, which also means less membership dollars. Now if you just slap him on the wrist, he thinks you are his buddy (i.e. good ol boy syndrome) Do the math. Bruic ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin Connell <kevin@nw*.co*> To: Mike Bruic <mikebruic@di*.co*> Cc: <cavers@cavers.com> Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 11:35 AM Subject: Re: NAMES PLEASE Mike, I think what you have here is a good 'ole boy's network going on. I've seen the same shit happen here in washington. An instructor making clear violations, being called on it, and getting off with a slap on the wrist, only to repeat the activity again and again. Nothing new. "No one supports any negative behavior" my ass. The more I think about it, the more I appreciate GUE. Not in and of itself, but the people that are attracted to the organization, like you were talking about earlier. At 08:34 AM 4/12/2000 -0400, you wrote: >Okay Tom, If IANTD chooses to hide things and hold Kangaroo Courts, so be >it. I really didn't think I would get anywhere pursuing this one with you, >and you proved me right. Tom just like you, I cc this letter also, it went >to cavers, so any comments you wish to make you can make to them also. > >Bruic > > >----- Original Message ----- >>From: <mailto:TOM.MOUNT@wo*.at*.ne*>Tom Mount >>To: <mailto:blander@un*.co*>Barb Lander ; >><mailto:bheard@dc*.ne*.au*>Barrie Heard ; >><mailto:mikebruic@di*.co*>Mike Bruic >>Cc: <mailto:bturbo@ga*.ne*>William J Turbeville II ; >><mailto:diving@sp*.co*>Victor Williams ; >><mailto:karlsenv@on*.no*>Vebjørn Karlsen ; >><mailto:orlowski@at*.ne*>Shelley orlowski ; >><mailto:deepreef@bi*.or*>Richard Pyle ; >><mailto:74663.1663@co*.co*>Richard Nordstrom ; >><mailto:info@oc*.co*.uk*>Richard Bull ; <mailto:regc@ca*.ky*>Reg >>Creighton ; <mailto:mandarin@ga*.ne*.hk*>Paul Neilsen ; >><mailto:paull@vi*.uu*.be*>Paul Lijnen ; >><mailto:divetech@ca*.ky*>Nancy Romanica ; <mailto:morgan@vi*.ed*>Morgan >>Wells ; <mailto:glimmer@mb*.kc*.ne*.jp*>Mitsu Tanaka ; >><mailto:Cochrane@ac*.co*>Kim Cochrane ; >><mailto:Kevingurrphoenix@cs*.co*>Kevingurrphoenix@cs.com ; >><mailto:altdive@ia*.co*.au*>Kevin Denlay ; >><mailto:john@sc*.co*>John Thornton ; >><mailto:johan@st*.se*>Johan Candert ; >><mailto:divetek@oc*.co*>Jim Mims ; <mailto:heinerth@gt*.ne*>Jill >>Heinerth ; <mailto:iantdhq@ix*.ne*.co*>iantdhq ; >><mailto:iantdfrance@wa*.fr*>iantdfrance ; >><mailto:100044.3401@co*.co*>IANTD UK ; >><mailto:info@ia*.co*>IANTD Sweden ; >><mailto:iantdsa@ia*.co*>IANTD South Africa ; >><mailto:egil@av*.fi*>IANTD Scandanvia ; >><mailto:khooss@si*.co*.sg*>IANTD S.E. Asia ; >><mailto:po12210@pt*.ib*.co*>IANTD Portugal ; >><mailto:techsec@i-*.co*.ph*>IANTD Philippines Alex ; >><mailto:psdivers@ku*.gu*.ne*>IANTD Micronesia ; >><mailto:aad@sa*.co*>IANTD Korea ; <mailto:iantdjp@di*.co*>IANTD >>Japan Training ; <mailto:IANTDIRL@ao*.co*>IANTD Ireland ; >><mailto:iantdgr@at*.mb*.gr*>IANTD Greece ; >><mailto:iantd@su*.de*>IANTD Germany ; <mailto:kony@un*.cz*>IANTD >>Czech ; <mailto:iantdbrazil@uo*.co*.br*>IANTD - BRAZIL ; >><mailto:gstanton@ma*.fs*.ed*>Gregg Stanton ; >><mailto:gildiver@di*.co*.br*>Gil ; <mailto:diveonmix@ao*.co*>gary >>taylor ; <mailto:ghowland@fw*.gu*.ne*>Garry Howland ; >><mailto:75204.1243@co*.co*>Frans Vandermolen ; >><mailto:fabio.ruberti@ti*.it*>Fabio Ruberti ; >><mailto:fabio_amaral@ya*.co*>Fabio Amaral ; >><mailto:haley@ca*.ky*>Erika Haley ; <mailto:egil@ad*.pp*.fi*>EGIL ; >><mailto:dick@hy*.co*>Dick Rutkowski ; >><mailto:dicklong@du*.co*>Dick Long ; >><mailto:DThomp@te*.es*>David Thompson ; >><mailto:buceo@ca*.co*>Casco Antiguo ; >><mailto:carl.douglas@sl*.se*>carl douglas ; >><mailto:tekdiver@na*.ar*.co*>Bill Nadeau ; >><mailto:lamar@di*.co*>Lamar Hires >>Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2000 9:23 AM >>Subject: Re: NAMES PLEASE >> >>Mike >> >>One as I told you if you think the BOA will feelthis is worth and ethics >>charge compared to the other issues we have to deal with then I will give >>you all their names and you may pursue it. >> >>I do not know of the past events where Rennaker has performed unethical >>actions that reflect on IANTD. Matter off act Bill has done little to >>effect IANTD one way or the other >> >>I seem to get the blunt of your attention I guess because IANTD is the >>only agency that even reviewed the circumstances and I'm the only one who >>even discusses it with you. So I guess that makes us the bad guy to you. >>So be it. >> >> >>Mike no one supports any negative behavior. I personally did give Bill a >>warning that if he had said such things it could not happen again, as I >>have already told you. I and Lamar and others on the IANTD bOA that I >>have talked to do not consider this to be a magnitude nor circumstance to >>warrant additional actions. We feel this is something you and Bill could >>and should ,as the N Fl cave community is rather small, work out among >>yourselves. >> >>Now Mike this is copied to the entire BOA so any comments you wish to >>make to them do so. >> >> >>Respectfully yours, >>Tom Mount >>CEO IANTD World HQ >><http://www.iantd.com>http://www.iantd.com >>>----- Original Message ----- >>>From: <mailto:mikebruic@di*.co*>Mike Bruic >>>To: <mailto:TOM.MOUNT@wo*.at*.ne*>Tom Mount >>>Cc: <mailto:lamar@di*.co*>Lamar Hires >>>Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2000 6:44 PM >>>Subject: Re: NAMES PLEASE >>> >>>>Tom, you wrote; >>>> >>>><Now no one is accusing anyone of lying accept you when you accuse them> >>>> >>>>Tom, I think you are missing the whole point here, "I AM ACCUSING >>>>RENNAKER OF LYING", and I have caught him lying twice trying to save >>>>his ass on this one already. I thought I already proved this to you, >>>>and the third time will be when I find out who the so-called witnesses are. >>>> >>>><The only reason anyone other than a couple of you know anything about >>>>this is because you made it a public knowledge> >>>> >>>>Tom read the letter, Bill himself acknowledges telling other people >>>>these lies, so I guess I should just sit there and take it huh. >>>> >>>><Lamar did say he did not smell beer on your breath but that he also >>>>was not very close to you.> >>>> >>>>I find that hard to believe since me and Lamar discussed in every >>>>detail where I looked, and where he should look. This even included >>>>drawing maps in the sand, but if this is what Lamar truly said, then I >>>>will accept it. >>>> >>>><I have not told Bill who supported you just that you had someone and >>>>he has not demanded the names> >>>> >>>>Tom, you know that Bill does not need the name, I CC'ed everything to >>>>him. Read my letter again, I do not have nothing to hide >>>> >>>>< why should I give these names to you..............you are not >>>>defending yourself from anyone or anything.> >>>> >>>>Tom, stop and think for a minute, why do you think I filed this >>>>complaint??? Rennaker tells people that I show up to cave recoveries >>>>drunk and screaming at him. That I I'm so drunk that I didn't even >>>>realize that I'm not wearing a drysuit when I get into the water. That >>>>he himself could have found the girl, but instead the sheriffs choose >>>>the drunk and stopped him from getting into the water. So, correct me >>>>if I'm wrong, but I take what you are saying here is that if someone is >>>>being prosecuted for lying the defense (Rennaker) can call any witness >>>>he wants to say anything they want and the prosecution (that is me) is >>>>not entitled to here this??? This sounds like a reverse angle to a >>>>Kangaroo Court to me. >>>> >>>><the two of you should set down and work it out> >>>> >>>>I tried to Tom, I even called "you" and Lamar on this one. Sadly, I >>>>think the only thing Rennaker would understand is a ass kicking, and I >>>>doubt that would do any good. Yes, I think he is that stupid. >>>> >>>><I do not think it is reveleant whether you had beer on your breath or >>>>not if you were not diving.> >>>> >>>>Ah Tom, wake up, I was diving. >>>> >>>> <this is not a serious issue nor one that has really affected you >>>> professionally or personally in any significant way.> >>>> >>>>Great, then you and Lamar won't take any offense at all when I start >>>>promulgating bullshit and lies about the two of you then will you. As a >>>>matter of fact, what you have demonstrated to me is that I can do it >>>>over and over again. I came to the you guys for resolution, not >>>>cover-up. You both know that it is not the first time Rennaker has done >>>>this kind of stuff before, and the way you choose to handle it in the >>>>past tells me it will undoubtedly not be the last. Rennaker has already >>>>disgraced and caused all the organizations he represents allot bad PR, >>>>and I have only started where others have left off. >>>> >>>>Bruic >>>> >>>>----- Original Message ----- >>>>From: <mailto:TOM.MOUNT@wo*.at*.ne*>Tom Mount >>>>To: <mailto:mikebruic@di*.co*>Mike Bruic >>>>Cc: <mailto:lamar@di*.co*>Lamar Hires >>>>Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2000 6:07 PM >>>>Subject: Re: NAMES PLEASE >>>> >>>>Mike >>>>I have been teaching thus not even thinking about this or reading emails >>>> >>>>Now no one is accusing anyone of lying accept you when you accuse them >>>> >>>>I have not told Bill who supported you just that you had someone and he >>>>has not demanded the names >>>> >>>>Thus why should I give these names to you and put then in a line of >>>>fire from you, they do not need to get a lot of heated emails because >>>>thy have made a statement. No one has made a complaint against you so >>>>you are not defending yourself from anyone or anything. Bill would have >>>>had more of a right to know as he was accussed by you, but he does not. >>>>If a action had been taken yes then he would have known the people who >>>>started the action. >>>> >>>>I had a long talk to Lamar today on this issue, he does not think this >>>>situation would result in anything accept a BOA action stating the two >>>>of you should set down and work it out as it is more personal than >>>>ethical. The only reason anyone other than a couple of you know >>>>anything about this is because you made it a public knowledge >>>> >>>>Lamar did say he did not smell beer on your breath but that he also >>>>was not very close to you. He does not look at this as a serious event >>>>and does not (like me) understand why it is being blown so far out of >>>>proportion. Have you read some of your own published post. >>>> >>>>I do not think it is reveleant whether you had beer on your breath or >>>>not if you were not diving. nor do I think anyone else would. And I >>>>definitely believe you were not drunk. I see no need to contact the >>>>sheriff deputies as no formal action is going to be pursued . >>>> >>>>We take a lot of actions on a lot of issues this is not a serious issue >>>>nor one that has really affected you professionally or personally in >>>>any significant way. If you want to push it then contact Lamar who is >>>>quite active on the BOA and I think he will state what I have just >>>>stated. Lamar is CCed on this post >>>> >>>>If you still are not satisified I will give you the entire BOA contacts >>>>and you can get everyones opnion but I think it will be about the same. >>>>Especially as some of your actions most likely would be considered as >>>>well . You know the old kittle and pot return >>>> >>>>Respectfully yours, >>>>Tom Mount >>>>CEO IANTD World HQ >>>><http://www.iantd.com>http://www.iantd.com >>>>>----- Original Message ----- >>>>>From: <mailto:mikebruic@di*.co*>Mike Bruic >>>>>To: <mailto:TOM.MOUNT@wo*.at*.ne*>Tom Mount >>>>>Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2000 3:00 PM >>>>>Subject: NAMES PLEASE >>>>> >>>>>Tom, Monday has come and gone and you still have not told me the names >>>>>of Rennaker's witnesses. They have had all weekend to collaborate and >>>>>get their lies straight, and just like Rennaker has a right to see my >>>>>witnesses, I do to. Or does he really have any? >>>>> >>>>>Bruic ---------------------------------- Kevin Connell <kevin@nw*.co*> NW Labor Systems, Inc http://www.nwls.com Pluralitas non est ponenda sine neccesitate. (plurality should not be posited without necessity - Occam's razor) ----------------------------------
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