I agree. The gap that I spoke of would exist because of market forces, irregardless of the nature of the organizations. I don't advocate a large base for cave diving. As a cave diver and dry caver here in Virginia I am all too well aware of the pressure that caves are under. Cave diving has aquired a cache, right or wrong. I don't know if we could go back to the days of a small, out of the light, pursuit, excercised by a dedicated few. That is what I mean by the post. I think it is a complex question, but I could be mistaken. Either way, Mike is excercising his property rights in a legitimate manner, and open honest discussion is also legitimate. If George did'nt give a damn about cave diving, which he obviously does, I'm sure he has better things to do than go through this vexation. I hope this helps illustrates my first post. Thanks for the input. Mark
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