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Group,
I want to respond to the following. Again I state sometimes some
archaeologists are wrong. Despite our best efforts to be perfect, we screw up.
I think it has something to do with us being human.
Some archaeologist have been instrumental in advancing the legislation referred
to below for several reasons. The most compelling is that the vessels being
protected have some historical value. Remember, documentation wasn't really
emphasized until about a 100 years ago.
Sometime archaeologists are wrong. But things can be changed if the reasons to
change them are sound. Just don't lump all of us together in the same bait
bucket, so in the end we all smell alike.
Don't get me going on Fisher's bunch. They should be restricted. If any of
you have ever been with Kane Fisher on one of his adventures you will know what
a loose cannon he is. Remember. He's the guy who turned on the mailboxes while
the National Geographic crew was on the Atocha. He almost killed the whole
bunch.
If you think a piece of legislation is wrong, do what the power brokers do.
Instead of pissin' and moanin' go find yourself some legislators and convince
them to change the laws. It ain't that hard. You can also go to NOAA with a
proposal to do volunteer work on a wreck. We did this with the Northern Light
off Key Largo. We felt it should be studied, developed a plan and took it to
NOAA. They approved it.
Paul
At 11:51 PM 1/25/97 -0500, GarlooEnt@ao*.co* wrote:
>Paul
>maybe you are telling the truth about your attitude towards divers.
>unfortunately for us that is not what the community of Arkies is saying.
>look at the record pal
> 1- Shipwreck act of (i forget the year) that placed all wrecks in
>inland waterways & the ocean within 3 miles in the ownership of the
>individual states.
> 2- look at the way the Salvors in Fla. were treated over the years
>since there efforts to find "treasure ships" brought up $$$. all there
>efforts to document using legitimate archaeologists were stonewald by the
>jealous arkies.
> 3- what about the UN MEETING IN SOUTH AMERICA (i think it was Buenos
>Ares) last year when a group of YOUR PEERS stood up & submitted a paper
>demanding that NO WRECK over a certain age could be dived by divers.
> (i love the next part)
>until the ARKIES either investigate it or not at there discretion regardless
>of the time involved. their attitude was that they would rather see the wreck
>& the artifacts turn to dust & be buried by the sand (never to be
>recovered)!!!!
> ******I HAVE TAKEN SOME LIBERTIES WITH THE TEXT BUT THE MEANING HAS
>NOT BEEN EMBELLISHED ***************
> 4- just a question -who found the wreck you are researching in
>Florida & how??
>
>In a message dated 97-01-25 17:25:55 EST, you write:
>
><<<< Subj: Re: Archaeologists
> Date: 97-01-25 17:25:55 EST
> From: pettennude@us*.ne* (Paul E. Pettennude)
> To: jlydon@zi*.ne* (John Lydon), wreckdiver@wreckdiver.com
>
> Why do you lump all archaeologists into one category? By the same token I
>could say that all divers are low life, loud mouth fools, but then again I
>would be lumping myself in both categories since I am an underwater
>archaeologist
>
>
> I personally don not see any harm in "polishing up" the bell, nor do I
>consider the Edmond Fitzgerald an archaeological site.
>
>
> There is a misconception about what archaeologists do. We are no longer
>into collecting "things", but in trying to understand what happened when
>things were not being written or when the written record was lost. The
>Edmond Fitzgerald does not fit into this category because we know what
>happened.
>
>
> By the same token, there is a shipwreck off Florida which may hold a key to
>altering history. There is some evidence which indicates the vessel is
>Portuguese and it predated Columbus's arrival by about a hundred years. In
>this instance I would not want a bunch of artifact collectors screwing around
>with the record until things are properly sorted out. This kind of work
>takes a while. We have to look at everything from the construction of the
>vessel to everything left behind to determine that it was not a Spanish
>vessel which had gotten its hands on a quantity of Portuguese coins.
>
>
> This summer I will be working in Belize trying to piece together a real
>puzzle. I have a site which involves a lagoon and in the middle of the
>lagoon is a sacred Mayan shrine. We want to learn exactly how the water in
>this lagoon played a role in the rituals associated with the shrine. Were
>there offering? Were there burials? Was the lagoon used for a dump? I sure
>as hell don't want a bunch of divers crawling into the water collecting pots
>while we are trying to sort out history.
>
>
> Archaeologists are not out to keep you from collecting stuff. Just use some
>common sense. Ask yourself, "Did someone die on the wreck?" If so, have the
>decency to leave things as they are out of respect for those who died. Ask
>yourself, "Is what I'm taking unique?" If the vessel played a significant
>role in history or is the last surviving example of an abandoned technology,
>why not check with the local maritime museum and put together a project
>whereby the whole community gets to see what you recovered. Be sure to have
>an archaeologist as part of your team to document the work.
>
>
> Enough said. I yield the soapbox.
>
>
> Paul Pettennude
>
>
>
>
>
> At 04:10 PM 1/25/97 -0500, you wrote:
>
> >D,
>
> >personally, I'd rather see the bell in it's "original" shape, style,
>whatever
>
> >you'd like to call it.
>
> >
>
> >I guess the tourists didn't think it was pretty enough, so they changed it.
>
> >
>
> >In either case, I can't see how the historical value has changed, whether
>it's
>
> >painted or polished, it's still a memorial to the crew of the Edmund
>Fitzgerald.
>
> >
>
> >The Archaeologists "always" seem to cry foul when things aren't done they
>way
>
> >they deem fit. Kind of a shame really. Divers and Archaeologists working in
>
>
> >tandem could do a lot of good work, but egos? get in the way??
>
> >
>
> >I'd love to see the memorial, maybe sometime soon I'll take a road trip out
>to
>
> >the Great Lakes and see it.
>
> >
>
> >Safe Diving,
>
> >John
>
> >
>
> >John Lydon
>
> >jlydon@zi*.ne*
>
>
>
>
("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._ Paul E. Pettennude, Ph.D.
`6_ 6 ) `-. ( ).`-.__.`) Maya Underwater Research Center
(_Y_.)' ._ ) `._ `.``-..-' pettennude@us*.ne*
_..`--'_..-_/ /--'_.' ,' Telephone (305) 554-1557
(il),-'' (li),' ((!.-' Fax Phone (305) 554-1616
<bold>
</bold>
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