At 08:13 AM 8/10/02 -0400, George Irvine wrote:

>  The fact is his dive buddy, Rick, built his
>own scooter quite some time ago and should know how they work.

This is true and he does. He also made one out of  Apollo parts, I have it 
and worked on the details. I do not like the body it is not streamlined, I 
have tested it and the Gavins are only a touch faster, I plan to rebuild it 
this winter and do away with the glued stuff and make very streamlined. My 
other Apollo, which all I did was remove the junk they put on the shroud in 
front of the prop and it now is faster than the Gavins.

>  The funny
>part is he used one of mine for that dive with JT, as did the third person
>diving,

He used Dave's because his has the old motor and can't keep up with the new 
motors, this was all planned out, we dived as a team. Dave also used the 
same scooter and dived with Bill who used an SS on the Ostfriesland 380ft, 
they matched speeds and depth.

>and Ms Young used no scooter, even though she has a rodney scooter.

She used no scooter, because she has not used hers very much and her dive 
buddy did not have one , they were diving RB and we were diving OC, I do 
not mix the divers up. They did not swim very far at that depth, we on the 
other hand went very far on the scooters and have the first video ever 
taken of that wreck.


>Cap't JT says he "busted" Rodney for putting a slow motor in Ms Young's
>scooter, and claims that rodney "made it right", but as we all know, the
>fast motor costs more in terms of materials and winding, and a lot more in
>warranty potential.

This is all true and I do believe he did charge her something for the up 
grade, but money means nothing to her, she has more than most people.


>I have even faster motors out on test with two of JT's boys

This is true, but you can't remember which ones you sent them to, you asked 
Cobb to look for a green glue strip or something to see if he had it, he 
had me look cause I had his scooter, now mine. Would you like for me to 
tell you which 2 have them, I know.

>as well as with
>a few others around the country, which I said I would replace with a
>standard WKPP motor if they have issues. So far they seem to be holding up.
>The purpose of the faster motor for wreck diving is to beat the current
>down the line and save kicking and pulling. The Florida guys say it will
>still not beat the Gulf Stream, but I have not heard any comment from JT's
>guys or the others who have them.

We have not encountered any current strong enough to test them yet, so no 
comment on that.


>For cave, we use the standard WKPP motor . For Mexico cave, those guys like
>the motor rodney used in Ms Youngs scooter that JT is complaining about -

  When Rodney came to show us his scooters he said he would not offer the 
slow motor anymore that he learned his lesson for putting the first one in.

>gives them massive burn time, but there the water is ten feet deep and
>there are sinkholes everywhere. I do not sell them with the slow motor -
>for those guys I sell them with no motor. I only use the WKPP motor , or
>one of the two higher thrust motors if requested for wreck only.
>
>I do have three of the ridiculous thrust motors for me, Casey and JJ as a
>"get out" scooter. This one is our first in and first dropped, and is then
>used in the last leg out of a long dive. The system we are currently
>exploring is a severe downstream and very deep, and at the last leg we have
>the most gear to bring out, so we use the ridiculous thrust motor for that
>last mile. Since I can rebuild them in minutes, this is ok for us , but not
>a good idea for anyone else for cave as the likelihood of overheating them
>and burning the brushboard is very high. On a wreck dive, there is not
>enough hammer time to make it an issue.
>
>From: "Jim Thompson SW" <jim@sh*.ne*>
>Subject: Cheap parts - video? RE: Cut to the chaseRE: VBTech vs. Nova Tech
>Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2002 23:59:34 -0700
>Captain JT wrote>>So you admit to selling the guys low end "Gavin Scooters"
>with low end
>parts, not like the ones you use..<<
>
>Captain JT,
>The reed that George used in the first set of HDPE was MUCH more expensive
>than the 5 dollar part that the WKKP uses! The more expensive clutch has
>always been an option.
>All the grudges aside, I am sure that you would AGREE that ONE MUST know
>their gear inside and out before diving. The HDPE's are a newer venture and
>for us, have proven to be ultra sturdy (we have even dropped TWO of them
>from about shoulder height)...
>The difference might be that George flew out to California to train us...
>we
>ASKED for the help when ordered the scooters and he didn't hesitate. I
>occasionally call; he has always been "immediately available and has
>provided unbelievable service"!  I hope all gets straighten out for you.
>We originally purchased the Gavins to extend our ra
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Jim Thompson SW [mailto:jim@sh*.ne*]
>Sent: Wednesday, August 07, 2002 3:00 AM
>To: Capt JT
>Cc: Quest@Gu*. Com; vbtech@ci*.co*; techdiver@aquanaut.com
>Subject: Cheap parts - video? RE: Cut to the chaseRE: VBTech vs. Nova
>Tech
>
>
>Captain JT wrote>>So you admit to selling the guys low end "Gavin Scooters"
>with low end
>parts, not like the ones you use..<<
>
>Captain JT,
>The reed that George used in the first set of HDPE was MUCH more expensive
>than the 5 dollar part that the WKKP uses! The more expensive clutch has
>always been an option.
>All the grudges aside, I am sure that you would AGREE that ONE MUST know
>their gear inside and out before diving. The HDPE's are a newer venture and
>for us, have proven to be ultra sturdy (we have even dropped TWO of them
>from about shoulder height)...
>The difference might be that George flew out to California to train us... we
>ASKED for the help when ordered the scooters and he didn't hesitate. I
>occasionally call; he has always been "immediately available and has
>provided unbelievable service"!  I hope all gets straighten out for you.
>We originally purchased the Gavins to extend our range and as pieces of
>SAFETY gear. What we have found, is that even on shallow beech dives these
>are FUN......(BTW have both long and shorts).
>In Northern California we run into this question from the recreation types;
>"Can you use those things in kelp?" I strapped a Video Camera to the body of
>a short and set out for the THICKEST kelp we could find.  If you would like
>to view the video www.shrinkwrap.net/ftp/BaueIanscooter.rm (7MB
>download) - This is in Real Media 9 format, if you need a RealPlayer get it
>here http://service.real.com/downloads.html (it is a pain in the ass to set
>up, but a nice media player nevertheless).
>Please keep in mind that MY video skills SUCK, we were not fully kitted, I
>didn't spent much time editing, this was the first time with a video housing
>strapped to my scooter and that this was just a shallow TEST dive ... even
>if you are not a hard core wreck or cave diver you will see that these
>Gavins are fun;-) BTW the seals love to swim with the scooters... :)
>
>Another cool thing about Gavins is that they have a service infrastructure
>hat George has set up and trained around the country like: 5th D in the
>pacific North West, Manta Ray in California, DiveTekAdventures in Hawaii,
>Walker in So cal? , Brownies etc. So you double your support when you buy a
>Gavin through on of these guys...
>
>Captian - Honestly, I hope things get straight for you ~ Jt
>
>
>
>--
>Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
>Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.


"You can't learn to dive on the net, sooner or later you have to get in the 
water"
Your Guide to Great Wreck Diving along the East Coast & more
  Web Site  http://www.capt-jt.com/
Email     captjt@mi*.co*


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