This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C1ABB7.66108C90
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit


Dave, this makes your tenth post to techdiver. Of the ten, eight are attacks
on me, two just driveling nonsense. In those posts, you use lies, innuendo,
rumor and bullshit to try to discredit Jarrod, me and the organizations we
have put together.

You go on to recommend dive instructors to innocent people that are among
the least attractive of the choices out there. I would be glad to publicly
explain why in detail , if you want to contest that with me.

I have produced more valuable and useful information than any combination of
people or agencies. I produce it, I give it out freely, I put it on my
website and on Jarrod's web site, and most people know they can call me any
time to get ideas or information. You don't see any of my dive partners on
here. Why? Because they don't want what I get by trying to pass on
information. Your loss. JJ has his agency and web site, but you can't get
him out here to be lied about and criticized with bullshit from anonymous
hotmail accounts or by novice cave divers like you who pass on rumors from
Bill Rennaker and others of the same ilk.

You and the group you were "trained" by see that quite differently. Real
information that works and makes sense is s huge threat to these people
because they are doing things quite differently, and feel the need to defend
that. The dive instructors who are not equipped with what I know or my
experience level hate it when a student or anyone else comes back to them
and says, "you told me this, but George says that".

They hate me and justify it by saying I am not "nice" to them, but they hate
Jarrod because by way of comparison and his mere existence, he makes them
all look pretty lame.

The end result is that people like you and your friends produce nothing but
crap, and you attack me on a personal level with made up bullshit because
none of you can produce an argument against what I am saying or in support
of what they do and teach that is anything but obvious nonsense.

I "infest" this list with information when I am not fighting off the likes
of you. You , on the other hand, have nothing for anyone but your lack of
knowledge and experience combined with an indoctrination in things that
don't work, and an full load of bullshit told to you by the losers out
there.


Subject: RE: [Cavers] Aloha to the Group
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 11:12:04 -1000
From: Dave Sams <dsams@al*.co*>

Well well,

So you infest this list also George?

Actually I was considering unsubing from Techdiver because of your
unmitigated bile and bullshit. Silly me, I subscribed to Techdiver (and
now Cavers) in the hopes of 1) listening in to some discussions on
equipment, technique, and locations; and 2) maybe finding a few possible
dive partners.

Instead about all I've been exposed to is your ranting paranoia. So let's
set the record straight, right now, so there are no mistakes:

First, I'm not the most experienced or best cave diver (or OW diver) in
the world. Probably not the smartest either, but I am willing to learn
and put out the effort required to improve my skills and knowledge.

Second, I too share many of your criticisms of the dive industry and
believe GUE to be a breath of fresh air.

Third, I don't hate you and am not your enemy (as you are so fond of
describing anyone who merely crosses your path, much less has the
temerity to disagree with you). Rather, I'm simply tired of your bullshit.

For someone with your record of accomplishments I would have expected so
much, well, more! However, instead of using the internet to disseminate
your ideas, what we get is your contempt. When you do provide some
information, you dole it out grudgingly, mere bits at a time -- mixed
liberally with expletives. Thus, as best I can see, you are your own
worst enemy. If people dislike you it's because of your unwarranted slurs
and character assassinations and mindless need to dominate and "win"
every discussion.

So, using small words I know you'll understand, fuck off George.

Dave




------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C1ABB7.66108C90
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4522.1800" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><STRONG></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN class=3D461014611-02022002>Dave, this makes your =
tenth post to=20
techdiver. Of the ten, eight are attacks on me, two just driveling =
nonsense. In=20
those posts, you use lies, innuendo, rumor and bullshit to try to =
discredit=20
Jarrod, me and the organizations we have put =
together.</SPAN></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN =
class=3D461014611-02022002></SPAN></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN class=3D461014611-02022002>You go on to recommend =
dive=20
instructors to innocent people that are among the least attractive of =
the=20
choices out there. I would be glad to publicly explain why in detail , =
if you=20
want to contest that with me.</SPAN></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN =
class=3D461014611-02022002></SPAN></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN class=3D461014611-02022002>I have produced more =
valuable and=20
useful information than any combination of people or agencies. I produce =
it, I=20
give it out freely, I put it on my website and on Jarrod's web site, and =
most=20
people know they can call me any time to get ideas or information. You =
don't see=20
any of my dive partners on here. Why? Because they don't want what I get =
by=20
trying to pass on information. Your loss. JJ has his agency and web =
site, but=20
you can't get him out here to be lied about and criticized with bullshit =
from=20
anonymous hotmail accounts or by novice cave divers like you who pass on =
rumors=20
from Bill Rennaker and others of the same ilk.</SPAN></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN =
class=3D461014611-02022002></SPAN></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN class=3D461014611-02022002>You and the group you
were =
"trained"=20
by see that quite differently. Real information that works and makes =
sense is s=20
huge threat to these people because they are doing things quite =
differently, and=20
feel the need to defend that. The dive instructors who are not =
equipped=20
with what I know or my experience level hate it when a student or anyone =
else=20
comes back to them and says, "you told me this, but George says that".=20
</SPAN></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN =
class=3D461014611-02022002></SPAN></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN class=3D461014611-02022002>They hate me and justify
=
it by=20
saying I am not "nice" to them, but they hate Jarrod because by way of=20
comparison and his mere existence, he makes them all look pretty=20
lame.</SPAN></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN =
class=3D461014611-02022002></SPAN></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN class=3D461014611-02022002>The end result is that =
people like=20
you and your friends produce nothing but crap, and you attack me on a =
personal=20
level with made up bullshit because none of you can produce an argument =
against=20
what I am saying or in support of what they do and teach that is =
anything but=20
obvious nonsense.</SPAN></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN =
class=3D461014611-02022002></SPAN></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG><SPAN class=3D461014611-02022002>I "infest" this list
with=20
information when I am not fighting off the likes of you. You , on the =
other=20
hand, have nothing for anyone but your lack of knowledge and experience =
combined=20
with an indoctrination in things that don't work, and an full load of =
bullshit=20
told to you by the losers out there.</SPAN></STRONG></DIV>
<DIV><STRONG></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG></STRONG> </DIV>
<DIV><STRONG>Subject:</STRONG> RE: [Cavers] Aloha to the Group</DIV>
<DIV><B>Date:</B> Thu, 31 Jan 2002 11:12:04
-1000<BR><B>From:</B> Dave =
Sams <A=20
href=3D"mailto:dsams@al*.co*"><dsams@aloha.com>=08</A><BR></DIV>&
lt;=
PRE>Well well,

So you infest this list also George?

Actually I was considering unsubing from Techdiver because of your=20
unmitigated bile and bullshit. Silly me, I subscribed to Techdiver (and=20
now Cavers) in the hopes of 1) listening in to some discussions on=20
equipment, technique, and locations; and 2) maybe finding a few possible =

dive partners.

Instead about all I've been exposed to is your ranting paranoia. So =
let's=20
set the record straight, right now, so there are no mistakes:

First, I'm not the most experienced or best cave diver (or OW diver) in=20
the world. Probably not the smartest either, but I am willing to learn=20
and put out the effort required to improve my skills and knowledge.

Second, I too share many of your criticisms of the dive industry and=20
believe GUE to be a breath of fresh air.

Third, I don't hate you and am not your enemy (as you are so fond of=20
describing anyone who merely crosses your path, much less has the=20
temerity to disagree with you). Rather, I'm simply tired of your =
bullshit.

For someone with your record of accomplishments I would have expected so =

much, well, more! However, instead of using the internet to disseminate=20
your ideas, what we get is your contempt. When you do provide some=20
information, you dole it out grudgingly, mere bits at a time -- mixed=20
liberally with expletives. Thus, as best I can see, you are your own=20
worst enemy. If people dislike you it's because of your unwarranted =
slurs=20
and character assassinations and mindless need to dominate and "win"=20
every discussion.

So, using small words I know you'll understand, fuck off George.
=20
Dave

</PRE></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C1ABB7.66108C90--


--
Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.

Navigate by Author: [Previous] [Next] [Author Search Index]
Navigate by Subject: [Previous] [Next] [Subject Search Index]

[Send Reply] [Send Message with New Topic]

[Search Selection] [Mailing List Home] [Home]