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All, does anyone want to take the count of people killed in TDI or IANTD classes doing deep air or other stupid things ? Does anyone want to take the count of dead IANTD and TDI instructors who did stupid things ? Does anyone want to then tell us that these stupid things are a good idea. Does anyone want to get on here and make a coherent argument against DIR? It is not possible. Now the strokes are really reaching. Berman was theirs in diving, ours as a friend who worked with some of my guys when they were kids in college at Ginnie Springs. He is a clear case of non DIR, a clear example that even a good diver is not immune from the consequences of doing stupid things. Hopefully his death will influence many others not to do these things, as it otherwise is nothing but a huge waste. "Wolvo" ( Wolov, actually ) was Navy doctor and aviator who in fact was a wonderful guy who provided us with all kinds of medical information from a source we otherwise would not have had access to. I liked Wolov, JJ liked Wolov, but Wolov needed more diving time with mentors before he ran off all over the world diving. He died at Scapa Flow doing something really ridiculous, he jumped overboard after a dive to retrieve his prescription mask with little of no gas left in his tank, and he drowned. Bobby McGuire was a Marine Corps Captain and a great guy, as tough as they come. Bobby was just starting to learn our way of doing things and I felt he would be a great contributor to WKPP, but then he not only went and violated Rule Number One, he dove unmarked bottles and ended up toxing. He died before we could ever make use of his talents in the WKPP. His big sin was that his father and brother wanted to do diving , too, so he made sure they had the properly marked bottles, and he took the unmarked ones. Bobby was way too tough for anyone who could not walk in his shoes to be on here talking about him, Berman was way too nice of a guy for the same. Wolov was a doctor who acted like a doctor and does not need to be talked about by anyone who has not made his contribution to this world. What our detractors need to look at is the 15,000 man dive hours of long range deep mixed gas cave exploration diving over the time I have run the WKPP, and at the record and records that go with that, at the contribution we have made to the knowledge base, at the example we have set in the face of massive embedded opposition from the air and bullshit crowd, the not for profit training agency JJ set up, the tapes and books he and I have put out, the TV shoes, and the massive influence we have had on a sport that was otherwise going no place fast, and then look at the pitiful alternative . Tell me I am wrong and make your case, or take a seat. -----Original Message----- From: Hans Petter Roverud [mailto:proverud@on*.no*] Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2001 1:34 AM To: techdiver@aquanaut.com Subject: RE: FW: Steve Berman At 07:41 PM 5/18/01 -0700, Michael J. Black wrote: >Funny how you Doing-It-Rightists keep lying and denying, and it helps >your cause so much when you disagree among yourselves. Friends and >students of Berman's seem to think he was a GUE instructor who dived >DIR, and helped in the past with the WKPP. Next thing you know, you'll >be calling him a "stroke," "barnyard stupid." And what's the "body count" >for you guys now...McGuirre, Wolvo, Berman, who else? MJB For the sake of argument, let's say he was a GUE instructor. He helped in the past with the WKPP. For all I know he may have dived DIR. Then he makes his last dive solo, runs out of gas and dies. That sounds more like a GUE instructor who (possibly) used to dive DIR to me. If a member of a group ignores the guidelines of his group and pays the ultimate price, what does this implicate: 1) That the guidelines were wrong or 2) That this person made a fatal mistake ignoring them? What you need for your case is a diver diving according to DIR protocol as his accident occurs. "Dived DIR" (in the past) is more than a bit like "used to wear a parachute". Hans -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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