Yes, it makes more sense now. I think Dave and I were talking the Big 
Picture, you were just talking hose and basic fittings. You have to have 
the connection for the scuba tanks, I got the "combination tank checker" 
which has  everything and removed the gauge and added quick disconnects to 
it, the hose and gauge. That allowed me to do several things with it, I had 
my hose made at a hose shop, high pressure/SS 1/4 MNPT on the ends(54 
dollars 6ft). The tank checker was around 125 dollars, I got 2 of them one 
for each end, then added quick disconnects to them and to the 02 & He 
bottle adapters, now I can go from Din to Din, Yoke to Yoke,Yoke to Din, 02 
or He to Din or Yoke and still use them as pressure checkers. I added a 
control valve and better gauges later on. This can be seen on my site right 
now on the gear tips page under "Mixing Kit"  www.capt-jt.com  I should 
have the "Bottles" page up by tomorrow. Mixing is not rocket science, the 
problem most have with it is "self confidence", one thing VBtech does when 
we prepare for a dive, you are invited and encourage to help and be present 
at your own mixing of your tanks. You do not need a card for that. The only 
draw back is what the shop has to pay for the He and then it is past on to 
the diver, if it was not for the "Lawyers" who would surely say it is 
unsafe in court to make a buck , everyone would be using welding gas.

   At 02:46 PM 9/30/00 -0400, Trey wrote:
>JT, I'm saying you can get that all from the gas
>supplier with the exception of the part that fits
>the scuba tank, not that you do not need it. I think
>we are  missing each other here someplace on this.
>The other end gets the threaded fitting that goes
>with the flex hose fittings.
>
>Anyway, the point is that one does not have to take
>a beating to do this, or deal with dive shop
>officiousness and card waving strokes.
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Capt JT <captjt@mi*.co*>
>To: George "Trey" Irvine <trey@ne*.co*>;
>dwiden@ho*.co* <dwiden@ho*.co*>; 'Scott'
><scottk@hc*.co*>; techdiver@aquanaut.com
><techdiver@aquanaut.com>
>Date: Saturday, September 30, 2000 12:39 PM
>Subject: Re: clarification was: An the beat goes on
>and on
>
>
> >Trey, you are exactly right, but you must point out
>that the whip you speak
> >of only goes one way. If you are doing stage mixes
>and they are yoke, you
> >will need an adapter, you also need to be able to
>go to 02 or He cylinder =
> >more parts or second whip.
> >The welding dealers here will sale you the gas, but
>you must have a
> >contract and pay cylinder rental. This is no new
>world for me, I have never
> >used anything but welding gas.
> >It is also a fact that more than one or 2 or even 3
>cylinders must be used
> >to obtain a fill in a set of doubles with a high He
>content, more so when
> >filling your own 02 deco tanks when doing a
>pressure fill. I am constantly
> >cycling out the low cylinders and putting new full
>ones at the end of the
> >"line" to have the high pressure one needs from
>doing the transfer pressure
> >fill procedure.
> >A booster pump makes it much easier, I will venture
>to say I make less
> >income than any diver who dives as much as I do and
>I do not do deep air.
> >It is a real burden for me, but it proves that if I
>can do it, so can those
> >who should quit diving deep air and be real
>leaders.
> >
> >  At 08:24 PM 9/29/00 -0400, Trey wrote:
> >>JT, I have Sherwood parts and the flex hose , T's
> >>and fittings that come from the gas supplier. 80
> >>bucks.  The difference between the "grades" of
> >>helium is the prices and the number of times they
> >>vacuum the bottles. It all comes from the same
>tank.
> >>
> >>The suppliers here will not sell welding for
>diving
> >>due to the accidents, but if one wanted to open an
> >>account as a welding operation, one could, but I
>get
> >>it delivered to the house. I'll pay the extra for
> >>the convenience.
> >>
> >>I realize this is Brave New World for most of you,
> >>but get serious, it is dead nuts simple.
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: Capt JT <captjt@mi*.co*>
> >>To: Trey <trey@ne*.co*>; dwiden@ho*.co*
> >><dwiden@ho*.co*>; 'Scott' <scottk@hc*.co*>;
> >>techdiver@aquanaut.com <techdiver@aquanaut.com>
> >>Date: Friday, September 29, 2000 8:03 PM
> >>Subject: Re: clarification was: An the beat goes
>on
> >>and on
> >>
> >>
> >> >Actually your both right and both wrong. No one
> >>here gets He and 02 as
> >> >cheap as I do. Of all the postings I've seen on
> >>prices, no one comes even
> >> >close to my price. Then again I am using
>Industrial
> >>grade gas ( better
> >> >known as welding gas) I do not offer it to
>anyone
> >>else as it becomes a
> >> >hassle for me to get and not everyone is
> >>comfortable with it, some think
> >> >they must have medical grade gas. Those that
>must
> >>purchase He though a dive
> >> >shop, must pay the higher price because they, in
> >>the best interest of the
> >> >customer must use the medical grade gas, which
>is
> >>much higher in cost. If
> >> >they did not and something happen surely a dive
> >>Lawyer of some kind would
> >> >get involved. Also I saw mentioned of a price
>for
> >>330cuft of He. There is
> >> >not a cylinder for that amount. A "T" bottle of
>He
> >>holds 286 cuft at 2,640
> >> >psi and a "K" bottle holds 213 cuft at 2,200
>psi.
> >>There is a seldom used
> >> >cylinder called a HC-500 which holds 432 cuft at
> >>4,500 psi , but I have
> >> >been unable to get one.  Those that have been to
>my
> >>home and seen the rows
> >> >of He and 02 can't believe I keep that much
>here.
> >>  I also have argon)
> >> >As for the whip, yes you can purchase a piss
>poor
> >>whip for 80 dollars, that
> >> >has no Gauge and is as short as my dick. I have
>the
> >>most advance portable
> >> >transfer whip "kit" made, with gauges, hose,
> >>anlayzer, quick disconnects
> >> >that allow me to do everything I need in a
> >>transfer. The 80 dollars won't
> >> >buy the pelican box that carries the stuff.It
>did
> >>not come from a dive shop.
> >> >Sometime this weekend I will put on my site all
>the
> >>facts about the 02,He
> >> >T&K bottles and others along with details and
> >>photos, I have often heard
> >> >people ask what the difference was, from this
>post
> >>you all should know now.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >At 08:38 AM 9/29/00 -0400, Trey wrote:
> >> >>ALL BULLSHIT - grade of helium means nothing.
>Here
> >>in SF we have to use USP
> >> >>because of the accidents that Mouth's idiots
>have
> >>had, but "welding" helium
> >> >>is fine. The parts can be obtained from the gas
> >>supplier, a whip is about 80
> >> >>bucks absolute MAX . You idiots are just used
>to
> >>the standard dive industry
> >> >>bullshit.
> >> >>
> >> >>----- Original Message -----
> >> >>From: David B. Widen <dwiden@ho*.co*>
> >> >>To: 'Scott' <scottk@hc*.co*>;
> >><techdiver@aquanaut.com>
> >> >>Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2000 7:03 AM
> >> >>Subject: RE: clarification was: An the beat
>goes
> >>on and on
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> > Scott
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I do not know where in the world you are but
> >>for USP HE I wish we could
> >> >>get
> >> >> > it from the suppliers for .13 ft. You are
> >>probably getting welding grade
> >> >>for
> >> >> > that. Plus you need to add the tank
> >>rental/delivery charges and unusable
> >> >>gas
> >> >> > (can get it all out) cost to the cu ft
>charge.
> >>The last time I check, a
> >> >>good
> >> >> > HE/O2 Parcial Pressure filler whip with
>gauges
> >>is $600-$800, O2 analyzer,
> >> >> > ignore the compressor and labor. What are
>parts
> >>of the business are there
> >> >> > cover.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > David
> >> >> >
> >> >> > > -----Original Message-----
> >> >> > > From: Scott [mailto:scottk@hc*.co*]
> >> >> > > Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2000 11:13
>AM
> >> >> > > To: techdiver@aquanaut.com; Trey
> >> >> > > Subject: Re: clarification was: An the
>beat
> >>goes on and on
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > The next thing we have to work on is a way
>to
> >>get the
> >> >> > > agencies to embrace
> >> >> > > hyperoxic trimix, and get it into the
>hands
> >>of advanced level
> >> >> > > recreational
> >> >> > > divers. I have been turning people on to
>HOTx
> >>for 6 months,
> >> >> > > but there are
> >> >> > > several problems:
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > Most people are charging .65 to .75 a foot
> >>for He, which is
> >> >> > > ludicrous, since
> >> >> > > the cost is a round .13 a foot. The
>typical
> >>reasons are
> >> >> > > "because I have to
> >> >> > > buy a compressor" blah, blah, blah. As a
> >>parallel, one of my
> >> >> > > buds has an
> >> >> > > office supply biz. He has two copiers that
> >>cost more than any
> >> >> > > compressor,
> >> >> > > and he gets a nickel a copy off one, and
>.25
> >>a copy from the
> >> >> > > other. Others
> >> >> > > sell double fills of trimix for 80 to 120
> >>dollars. We can
> >> >> > > double the money
> >> >> > > on our gas at $16 for singles, and around
>$28
> >>to $32 for most
> >> >> > > dubs. This rip
> >> >> > > off has to be brought to light as well.
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > NO ONE should have to take $9,000 worth of
> >>TDI or IANTD
> >> >> > > training to be able
> >> >> > > to use the gas, which, in reality, is
>*safer*
> >>than air for diving.
> >> >> > > Without a trimix shingle, or a guy like me
> >>who will do a fill
> >> >> > > for people I
> >> >> > > know, they are unable to use the gas
>anywhere
> >>else, unless
> >> >> > > they blend it in
> >> >> > > their garage, which many are doing.
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > I took a gent out yesterday to dive on the
> >>gas, and he was
> >> >> > > amazed at how
> >> >> > > much better he felt afterwards. Normally,
>his
> >>hands really
> >> >> > > hurt after diving
> >> >> > > air (slightly arthritic), but HOTx didn't
> >>have that effect.
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > I brought this up to the "instructor base"
> >>over on rec.scuba, and they
> >> >> > > howled like a bunch of mashed cats. NAUI
>and
> >>IANTD totally
> >> >> > > missed the ball
> >> >> > > on this one with their "Normoxic trimix
> >>course", which is
> >> >> > > just another way
> >> >> > > to separate you from your money.
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > Before anyone starts screaming, lets just
> >>remember the noise made when
> >> >> > > Nitrox was suggested for recreational
>divers.
> >>Mountains of
> >> >> > > dead divers were
> >> >> > > predicted...
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > Scott
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > ----- Original Message -----
> >> >> > > From: Trey <trey@ne*.co*>
> >> >> > > To: <techdiver@aquanaut.com>; Mike Strong
> >><divermike@fn*.ne*>
> >> >> > > Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2000 1:09 PM
> >> >> > > Subject: Re: clarification was: An the
>beat
> >>goes on and on
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > > If all of us insist that these guys do
> >>things properly ,
> >> >> > > then they will
> >> >> > > find
> >> >> > > > a way to do that.
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > The problem is that when idiots like
> >>Gilliam get into the
> >> >> > > mix, we all
> >> >> > > > suffer. I can't imagine traveling 12,000
> >>miles to dive in a
> >> >> > > great spot and
> >> >> > > > doing it on air.
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > We have the same problem in New Jersey,
> >>where the Seeker
> >> >> > > idiots proudly
> >> >> > > dive
> >> >> > > > air and bullshit gear, like "poney"
>bottles
> >>of air with air
> >> >> > > in doubles
> >> >> > > >  just to be sure there is no mistake
>about
> >>how dumb they are) with
> >> >> > > > slobwinders to turn the ponies on. They
> >>serve a clientele
> >> >> > > of strokes.
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > The harder we make it for the idiots to
>be
> >>idiots, the
> >> >> > > better it will be
> >> >> > > for
> >> >> > > > all of us.
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> >> >> > > > From: Mike Strong <divermike@fn*.ne*>
> >> >> > > > To: <techdiver@aquanaut.com>
> >> >> > > > Cc: <trey@ne*.co*>
> >> >> > > > Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2000 3:37
>PM
> >> >> > > > Subject: clarification was: An the beat
> >>goes on and on
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > > List:
> >> >> > > > >
> >> >> > > > > There has been some confusion about my
> >>views, and what I
> >> >> > > did or did not
> >> >> > > > say
> >> >> > > > > regarding a Truk Lagoon Trip.  Most of
> >>these messages were in the
> >> >> > > private
> >> >> > > > > forum, but I want to say all this in
>the
> >>open.
> >> >> > > > >
> >> >> > > > > I DO NOT support any form of deep air
> >>diving, diving
> >> >> > > below 130' without
> >> >> > > > > Helium, or any diving operation
>involved
> >>with Brett
> >> >> > > Gilliam, TDI, or any
> >> >> > > > of
> >> >> > > > > his buddies.  The shop I work for is
> >>taking a trip to
> >> >> > > Truk, on the boat
> >> >> > > > > Odyssey.  This vessel, at the
>encouraging
> >>of Bret
> >> >> > > Gilliam, allows *and*
> >> >> > > > > supports Deep air diving to depths of
> >>200, because
> >> >> > > Gilliam says in the
> >> >> > > > > ocean you are safe to that depth.  I
>DO
> >>NOT agree.  It is
> >> >> > > very clear
> >> >> > > that
> >> >> > > > > this guy is a moron, and the charter
> >>company is falling
> >> >> > > victim to his
> >> >> > > > > stupidity.
> >> >> > > > >
> >> >> > > > > As for the trip, I have suggested to
> >>several members of
> >> >> > > the trip that
> >> >> > > the
> >> >> > > > > answer is to limit the diving on the
>trip
> >>to depths of
> >> >> > > 130 or shallower,
> >> >> > > > or
> >> >> > > > > not go at all.  (Helium, which is
> >>available, is *very*
> >> >> > > expensive, so my
> >> >> > > > > thinking is that it makes more sense
>to
> >>not do the deep
> >> >> > > dives, rather
> >> >> > > than
> >> >> > > > > to pay for the He)  As for the other
> >>suggestions on the
> >> >> > > list regarding
> >> >> > > > > "diving to 140 or 150, mabey the 200
>foot
> >>dive...," in
> >> >> > > Truk, I also DO
> >> >> > > NOT
> >> >> > > > > agree with this.  This is the exact
>thing
> >>we all are
> >> >> > > trying to get away
> >> >> > > > > from, It is not safe, nor is it "OK,"
>to
> >>do these dives
> >> >> > > without the use
> >> >> > > of
> >> >> > > > > Helium.
> >> >> > > > >
> >> >> > > > > I am a firm supporter of the DIR idea
>and
> >>those who have
> >> >> > > put in the time
> >> >> > > > > and effort to make it work--If you
>want
> >>to do it DIR in
> >> >> > > Truk, you have 3
> >> >> > > > > choices:  Pay for the gas, stay above
> >>130, or refer to
> >> >> > > Rule #1.  Most, I
> >> >> > > > > would think would refer to Rule
> >>#1........
> >> >> > > > >
> >> >> > > > > Finally, I would like to point out
>that
> >>it is up to us as
> >> >> > > divers to get
> >> >> > > > the
> >> >> > > > > point across to these charters....deep
> >>air is not safe.
> >> >> > > I hope this
> >> >> > > post
> >> >> > > > > has cleared up this mess, and that
> >>everyone knows where I
> >> >> > > stand now.
> >> >> > > > >
> >> >> > > > > Best,
> >> >> > > > >
> >> >> > > > > Mike Strong
> >> >> > > > >
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > --
> >> >> > > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing
>list
> >>to
> >> >> > > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
> >> >> > > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to
> >> >> > > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > --
> >> >> > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list
>to
> >> >> > > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
> >> >> > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to
> >> >> > > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > --
> >> >> > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list
>to
> >>`techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
> >> >> > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to
> >>`techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>--
> >> >>Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to
> >>`techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
> >> >>Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to
> >>`techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
> >> >
> >> >"You can't learn to dive on the net, sooner or
> >>later you have to get in the
> >> >water"
> >> >Your Guide to Great Wreck Diving along the East
> >>Coast & more
> >> >  Web Site  http://www.capt-jt.com/
> >> >Email     captjt@mi*.co*
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >
> >"You can't learn to dive on the net, sooner or
>later you have to get in the
> >water"
> >Your Guide to Great Wreck Diving along the East
>Coast & more
> >  Web Site  http://www.capt-jt.com/
> >Email     captjt@mi*.co*
> >
> >
> >--
> >Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to
>`techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
> >Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to
>`techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
> >

"You can't learn to dive on the net, sooner or later you have to get in the 
water"
Your Guide to Great Wreck Diving along the East Coast & more
  Web Site  http://www.capt-jt.com/
Email     captjt@mi*.co*


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