Mailing List Archive Mailing List Archive
Sorry Al, I must of missed something here????? I was agreeing with most of what you said, I was only perhaps explaining a different scenario. Reading is a new thing to me, I usually enjoy the pictures. Regards dave. Al Marvelli wrote: > show me where i said to use a weight belt in an overhead environment. You cant because i > didnt. > > Of course you want non ditchable weight in a cave. > > reading is fundamental you know. > > Al Marvelli > > David Blundell wrote: > > > Al, > > > > You make some valid points. > > > > But (aside from diving sidemounts) what if you want to negotiate a restriction under > > water that requires you to remove your gear so you can squeeze through then continue > > your dive. Whilst like I said I prefer to wear side mounts for this but at the same > > time it is not unreasonable to backmount such a dive. Also if the restriction was to > > narrow for large side mount tanks to squeeze through safely, then maybe you may need > > to push one tank through in front of you first. Such a situation would require you to > > be confident that you were negative when such gear/tank is removed. > > > > Granted on most diving situations, you don't have to take your gear off, but there are > > some such situations, then you don't want to be positive when you do underwater. it > > my be a rare situation that you have to take your gear off, but do you stick your head > > in the sand and say that it would never happen. I hate wearing weight belts, but my > > suit and thick thermals are positive, that I could wave at the shuttle if i let go at > > depth. Therefore I prefer to have some weight around my waist, in some dives. > > > > Also I guess that if you need extra weight, and you mount it in between your tanks, I > > won't be busting my ring lifting your tanks out of the boat like we do in Victoria. > > > > Some times you have to me flexible. > > > > Regards > > > > Dave. > > > > Al Marvelli wrote: > > > > > What i find interesting is that everybody seems to think the exact second you lose > > > your weights you will immediately rocket to the surface. In neo you suit is > > > crushed and you have to swim up a little to get it going. Otherwise water is 800 > > > times denser than air and you have a few seconds to react, unless you are stoned > > > to the bone on air. > > > > > > The other funny thing is that people cant seem to differentiate between overhead > > > or cave and open water rigs, one is negative for a reason < cave to keep you off > > > the roof, where you can get trapped or in deco anything away from the surface > > > where you will fizzle to death> and one is not <open water you may need to GO UP> > > > If you have been playing along here you should know the difference; George has > > > been quite clear over the years with this one. > > > > > > The only place you take your rig off is in the pool infront of students, or on the > > > surface, where weights dont matter. > > > > > > Al Marvelli > > > > > > Jim Cobb wrote: > > > > > > > Hey, Johnny I don't know what kind of diving you are doing "down under" but > > > > the kind of diving we do up here, if you get to the point that you have to > > > > take your rig off during the dive, you are pretty much fucked, screwed, > > > > blued and tattooed, weightbelt or no. > > > > > > > > Is it just me or does this not seem rather obvious to the rest of the list? > > > > > > > > Please refrain from further posts until you know what the fuck you are > > > > talking about. > > > > > > > > Jim > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Learn About Trimix at http://www.cisatlantic.com/trimix/ > > > > > > > > > From: "John McMillan" <mcmillan_knit@on*.ne*.au*> > > > > > Reply-To: "John McMillan" <mcmillan_knit@on*.ne*.au*> > > > > > Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 21:30:13 +1000 > > > > > To: "Techdiver Mailing List" <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > > > > > Subject: Re: Weights > > > > > > > > > > I read a lot of crap in the many posts that have been presented over the > > > > > last few days regarding weighting. Most of the suggestions have been down > > > > > right bloody dangerous, stupid, and idiotic. Hey guys what happened to > > > > > keeping it simple. We should weight ourselves with out tanks harness etc > > > > > attached, just negative. if we are still negative with the tanks and harness > > > > > etc on then we are correctly weighted. Using the traditional weight belt is > > > > > the most effective way of doing this. Have a bloody good think about why you > > > > > should be weighted this way before you make any comments. The guys that want > > > > > to wear tank weights etc all over the place have a think about buoyancy > > > > > control if you have to take your gear off in water at depth. If and when the > > > > > shit hits the fan and you have to do this with weights all over your gear > > > > > "good luck". > > > > > > > > > > Hoo Roo > > > > > Johnny Mack > > > > > Down Under > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: John Walker <techdive@ea*.ne*> > > > > > To: <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > > > > > Sent: Friday, June 16, 2000 10:11 AM > > > > > Subject: Re: Weights > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> Hell Cobber they give me a sore back. I'd bet Mike Black (you know, > > > > > the > > > > >> guy that doesn't dive) would consider this a Type 2 DCS hit. > > > > >> > > > > >> Dr. John Walker > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> ----- Original Message ----- > > > > >> From: Jim Cobb <cobber@ma*.ci*.co*> > > > > >> To: Al Marvelli <ajmarve@ba*.ne*>; Paul Braunbehrens > > > > >> <Bakalite@ba*.co*> > > > > >> Cc: <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > > > > >> Sent: Wednesday, June 14, 2000 9:02 AM > > > > >> Subject: Re: Weights > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >>> Weight belt for wetsuits. Weight belt fucks up the airflow in your > > > > > drysuit > > > > >>> and is a failure point. I hate weight belts. > > > > >>> > > > > >>> Jim > > > > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > >>> Learn About Trimix at http://www.cisatlantic.com/trimix/ > > > > >>> > > > > >>>> From: Al Marvelli <ajmarve@ba*.ne*> > > > > >>>> Date: Tue, 13 Jun 2000 03:24:40 -0400 > > > > >>>> To: Paul Braunbehrens <Bakalite@ba*.co*> > > > > >>>> Cc: techdiver@aquanaut.com > > > > >>>> Subject: Re: Weights > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> I dont mean to flame Paul personally but I have to ask some simple > > > > >> questions > > > > >>>> here. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Why is the weight belt not ideal? its cheap, easy to learn, and found > > > > >>>> everywhere. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> The belt gives you a built in failure indicator< if you are paying > > > > >> attnetion > > > > >>>> you can feel it slip, and thats easy to correct on your own> and if > > > > > its > > > > >>>> under you crotch stap has a built in anti ditch safety. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> and also > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> what is the facination with non ditchable weight? > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> especially on a rig that is limited to no stop diving by definition?? > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> I can understand its significance on a deco dive, but you all do > > > > > realize > > > > >>>> that if your worst fears come true and you undergo a buoyant ascent , > > > > >> you > > > > >>>> are merely performing skills practice?? That evey agency has blow and > > > > > go > > > > >> as > > > > >>>> its last resort for ndl diving? > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> have any of you removed your weights during a dive? what was the > > > > > result? > > > > >> I > > > > >>>> had my belt off three times in front of the class i was helping with > > > > >> tonite, > > > > >>>> no problem with an al 80 with an al plate and a 1/4 suit in 12 ft of > > > > >> water, > > > > >>>> i had plenty of time to dump the bc and remain with my weight belt > > > > > with > > > > >> just > > > > >>>> a little effort. Are we all just not paying attention? > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> worried about buckle failure? wear two. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> We are not even going to get into the pony bottle, but fyi my > > > > >> understanding > > > > >>>> of hogarthian means ultra minimal as in no reserve gas, even in > > > > >> overhead. > > > > >>>> and of course the bottle is unnecessary for anything, you can either > > > > >> blow > > > > >>>> and go or you cant and if you cant you need a real redundant system, > > > > > not > > > > >> 13 > > > > >>>> freaking cu ft. This w/e i was forced to dive off the bow b/c the > > > > >> customers > > > > >>>> used up all the rack space with their pony bottles filled with nitrox > > > > >> too > > > > >>>> hot for the bottom< typical, they have all been hosed and regard dir > > > > > as > > > > >>>> internet bs>and then i had to endure the shop owners bitching about my > > > > >>>> doubles being too much gear for the dives< which they were, but i > > > > > needed > > > > >>>> them empty and gas costs money so i aint freaking wasting it>so i am > > > > >> ready > > > > >>>> for all comers on this pony bullshit. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> You dont need a pony bottle unless you are solo diving without a plan. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Think it through people. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Al Marvelli > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> PS if those two quarry guys dont send me snail addresses ill never be > > > > >> able > > > > >>>> to mail them schedules and since i lost my inbox i dont havetheir e > > > > >>>> addresses, so get back to me fellas. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> Paul Braunbehrens wrote: > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>>> OK, I went through tons of archives last night, trying to get to the > > > > >>>>> bottom of this. First, let me tell you my setup. I'm diving a > > > > >>>>> backplate and wings, with a drysuit, and (for now) a single tank and > > > > >>>>> a pony bottle. Leaving enough air in my suit so I can still move and > > > > >>>>> do a safety stop at the end of a dive, I need 17 pounds on my belt (I > > > > >>>>> dive in cold water). > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> Right now this weight is on my weight belt, which is ok but not > > > > > ideal. > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> Perusing the archives, it seems the consensus is to make a V weight > > > > >>>>> for at least some of this. Let's say it will weigh about 9 Pounds. > > > > >>>>> This still leaves 8 pounds. I could then either leave that on my > > > > >>>>> weight belt, or I could put it in the Halcyon weight pouches. I > > > > >>>>> assume that when I go to doubles I won't need most of it anymore? > > > > >>>>> Also, DiveRite sells a "trim weight" that will fit between the bolts > > > > >>>>> on the backplate. I was thinking of this as an option. > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> Also, I read a lot of posts saying the canister light is 6 pounds > > > > >>>>> negative (or thereabouts). Mine is 1.5 pounds negative, which means > > > > >>>>> I have to account for that weight somewhere. > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> One post I read which made a lot of sense, said that you should have > > > > >>>>> about 5 or 6 pounds of ditchable weight (if any). When you ditch > > > > >>>>> your weight you don't want to become so positive as to end up in > > > > >>>>> lunar orbit. > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> I would like to get as close to hogarthian as possible before moving > > > > >>>>> to doubles, so any help is appreciated. I'm even moving my canister > > > > >>>>> back on my harness (I had it upside down and attached to the > > > > >>>>> backplate, but I find that it has a tendency to sit on the wiring > > > > >>>>> connection...not good). > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> Cheers, > > > > >>>>> > > > > >>>>> -- > > > > >>>>> Paul Braunbehrens mailto:Bakalite@ba*.co* > > > > >>>>> http://www.daw-mac.com Mailing list for digital audio on the mac > > > > >>>>> -- > > > > >>>>> Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > > > > > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > > >>>>> Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > > > > >> `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> > > > > >>>> -- > > > > >>>> Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > > > > > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > > >>>> Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > > > > > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > >>>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> > > > > >>> -- > > > > >>> Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > > >>> Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > >>> > > > > >> > > > > >> -- > > > > >> Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > > >> Send subscrX-Mozilla-Status: 0009ts to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > > > > > -- > > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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