Brock, substance use or abuse is not tolerated in the WKPP in any form,
whether it be casual, "recreational",  addictive or a "problem". It is
hard enough to do what we do with out that bullshit.

While my personal discontinution of drugs and alchohol years ago was the
result of using cocaine ( and to an extreme) , the others all have their
own reasons, most of which are simply seeing my example and seeing what
the human body can do at any age when treated correctly. Some may or may
not have thought themselves to have a "problem". Parker thought he did,
so he was really adamant about being clean and sober , was vocal about
it, and as such pissed off the same slobs that I piss off. 

If it were not for coke, which gives you the instant wakup call, I might
still be drinking , which would really suck at my age, or any age for
that matter. It was a bad experience , but I am so glad I went through
it and got there fast. 

It is pretty funny when fat , drunken , pot-smoking slobs want to talk
about what I did prior to being 33 years old ( I am 48 now ), or what I
did in college as a kid, or whatever. The real assholes usually like to
point out that I got divorced, or that I got arrested for punching out
two cops ( did not know they were cops, but I was high at the time, and
was a college wrestler so got it for using "weapons") or whatever else I
did that they think they know something about, without knowing any of
the real background on me , or ever wondering why I know what I know or
can do what I do. Makes no difference. This is not about that.

I have been a good influence on my guys in every respect, and the rest
of these nitwits are nothing but a huge problem for all of us and
themselves.  

The fact is that normal poeple do not get drunk or high - they do not
care to do so. 

I prefer to deal with players on my team who have already discovered
that they do not want to be users and boozers, and have decided to
pursue a healthy lifestyle. That in itself causes a huge backlash by the
slobs.

I remember when Gilliam was writing a "good" article about me in his
"Deeptec" magazine. I told his interviewer that I was on the board of
directors of a drug and alchohol treatment center here in town, and that
I was a Stephen Minister at the Methodist church handling the same type
of things ( I no longer am involved in either activity). He said, " we
do not want to print that since people might think you are an addict",
and in that article he also thought it was so funny that I was so
outspoken about diving gear and such,  but when I criticized his deep
air diving and the deep ari diving death of Rob Palmer, he published
another article in which he dwelled on these subjects, the divorce, the
substances, etc., and put a picture of me with fangs on the cover sheet.

You can see that while none of this has anything to do with diving, the
strokes out there use it in response to my criticism of their practices
like it will make stupid not stupid any more if I did waht they do now,
and that tells it all. Notice however that Tom Mouth never goes there,
and he hates me the most, or second most.

Sidney Brock Frederickson wrote:
> 
> Trey:
>     I'm hoping this goes through they way it should- MSN seems to not like
> email lists but here goes
> 
>     MJBMD or whoever the fucking hell you are, listen up. I'm 45, clean and
> sober 12 years and you have no gawddam right to say shit like this about
> anyone who has ever desired to or gotten sober. You wanna talk pain, you
> wanna talk needs, you wanna talk obsessed ? c'mon buddy let's go out to the
> wood shed and I'll lay some facts on ya.
>     These gentlemen have given me more direction, information, advice,
> useful - ya hear that dickhead- usefull critiques than any of the PADI/TDI
> twits that have come up to me with my rig and started their spiel with"you
> doing that wrong"....
>     Thanks to them I have two fantastic mentors- Jason Wiesacosky in
> Missouri and Mike Jackson here in OKC- Yeah Oklahoma City, OK nit wit.
> Thanks to them the worst purchase I've made was 35 bucks for a Ikelite PCa
> backup light. Everything else is used consitently. Thanks to the free
> information here, to the inspiration of their websites and the time they
> take to answer my few questions, I'm years ahead of other divers my age. I
> started back at this sport just a couple of years ago, but I know that my
> dives are safe, my gear is top notch, and my body in shape for the next
> dive, as opposed to the fat, beer bellied, whiney lushes who "do"Cozumel
> twice a year and get winded carrying their al80 singles across the parking
> lot.
>     Everything here has been of some use to me- Even your wonderful negative
> examples which remind me- "there but for the grace of god go I" .
>     So it's simple Mr What ever your name is. As we say in AA to the
> newcomers.
> " Take the cork from your ears, stick it in your mouth and sit on your
> hands- you may just learn something"  but some still never get the message.
>     rant over- back to lurker mode
> 
>     Brock
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Trey <trey@ne*.co*>
> To: Scott <scottk@hc*.co*>
> Cc: Jim Cobb <cobber@ma*.ci*.co*>; Michael J. Blitch
> <mblitch1@ta*.rr*.co*>; Dan Volker <dlv@ga*.ne*>; Jess Armantrout
> <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>; <cavers@ca*.co*>; <techdiver@aquanaut.com>
> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 11:09 AM
> Subject: Re: Reality Sucks for the "old timers"
> 
> > Guys , post this to rec scuba for me, as well as any other list that it
> > needs to go on:
> >
> >  I guess the last pot I smoked when I was 22 , or the last coke I did in
> > 1984 or the last beer I had in 1987 is still effecting my mood, whereas
> > those who want to criticize me, like Dustin or Giliam, can not make that
> > claim. They can also not show a single dive equal to my weeniest dive,
> > and certainly none of them can show a whole project and track record,
> > not to mention several "world's records" for the last several years like
> > I can, nor can they show a contribution to diving approximating what I
> > have done and contributed at my own expense, and certainly none of them
> > can make a case for anything as comprehensive or sensible as my "DIR"
> > philosophy of diving, complete with details , reasons, and logic.
> >
> >  Separately, our boy Black is not privy to the information that we have,
> > and is misleading people with inaccurate, outdated , long ago proven
> > wrong , NONSENSE, and is attacking me personally on a non diving basis
> > as his only rationale for his reckless, irrepsonsible behavior. He will
> > always find Gilliams, Dustins, Mouths and others anxious to do the same,
> > anxious to discredit what they themselves can not do out of resentment
> > and hatred.
> >
> >  The really ridiculous thing about this hypocrite is that he is
> > criticizing my "style" when his posts are embarrasing at best in their
> > own "style". The fact is that the Giliams, Dustins, the Tom Mouths and
> > Mike Blacks do not like me because I have no tolerance for any
> > stupidity, diving or otherwise, amd point blank about it, and am totally
> > willing to get out and argue it with them publicly , and it makes them
> > look pretty bad, which of course is the whole issue here. I won't keep
> > my mouth shut in the face of bullshit, like Glliam's deep air, or
> > Mouth's endlsss crap, or Dustin's critcism of the WKPP, or Mike Black's
> > insane pronouncements and practices.
> >
> >  Mike Black need to be treated like the dangerous , unscrupulous,
> > misinformed, irresponsible low life that he has proven he is willing to
> > be in the pursuit of his personal dislike for me. So long as everyone
> > can see how bad this guy has become, he is actually serving a good
> > purpose - making bullshit look like bullshit, and making dangerous
> > stupidity obviously so. Hopefully, this will serve to deter people from
> > doing dumb things, and will give enough play to DIR to get people to go
> > have a look for themselves at that logic and seek out the information we
> > all want and need, which is so freely given away by the WKPP and its
> > friends, at no cost , for no other reason other than to  give back what
> > we have been lucky enough to recieve.
> >
> >  Last Saturday Jarrod and I broke our own World Record at Wakulla by
> > travelling further into the cave than our previous 18,065 feet ,
> > decompressed out in less than 8 hours each, and once again showed new
> > techniques and new technology in diving that we shared with the world.
> > Our execution of this dive in one day using the WKPP team of pros sets
> > the example once again of what can be done when it is DIR, while Mike
> > Black and the rest continue to argue that I do now know what I am doing.
> >
> >  The information we have assembled in the lsst ten years in this project
> > is all available to anyone and everyone, and I encourage all of you who
> > seek more knowledge in diving to check out the WKPP and DIR and GUE and
> > their offerings and databases, and to avail yourselves of this in lieu
> > of the commonly availble slop that is being shoved at you now. My stuff
> > is all free other than the tapes which are cheap and sold through
> > Extreme Exposure, so use it in the spirit in which I do it and offer it
> > - to give you the benefit of what we all seek and have a tough time
> > finding - the real good info that we all deserve.
> >
> >  I hope you all can excuse my absolute hatred of the strokes out there -
> > they spell death and destruction , and we are all in this for fun and
> > pleasure - they are robbing us blind. If you can not excuse my feelings
> > and passion about his, then at least just go look at the logic. You do
> > not have to like me at all, it is not about me, it is about diving.I am
> > just the only one who is willing to put on the helmet every day and go
> > bash heads with these strokes. Take your pick. I am the one willing to
> > be slandered and insulted by people who could not carry my dick,  and
> > willing to put on the gloves, or take them off as it would be , with
> > some of the worst influences in diving today, and some of the most
> > institutionalized stupidity ever assembled in the name of "training" . I
> > will win out over them in the long run, because I am right and they are
> > wrong, and obviously , more and more people are seeing that, and these
> > people will eventually be reviled as idiots as you are able to
> > assimilate the information that we have assembled that we are willing to
> > share so freely.
> >
> > George Irvine
> > Project Director
> > Woodville Karst Plain Project ( WKPP )
> >
> 
> --
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