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Now your a dive physiologist. Jess Armantrout wrote: > wrong, scumbag, I got skinbends from being dehydrated (and thus stupid) > after hiking through the mexican jungle for 7 kilometers followed by a 350' > dive. When is the last time you covered 7 kilometers in anything other than > a car? > Wrong. 3 miles every other day. Weights on days off. > > Talk about give it a rest, you've got everybody and their brother coming on > here and telling you you're an idiot, even guys that have no association > with George and/or the WKPP. Do you think that maybe, just maybe, you are > indeed an idiot after all? > > -----Original Message----- > From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> > To: kirvine@sa*.ne* <kirvine@sa*.ne*> > Cc: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>; techdiver@aquanaut.com > <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > Date: Thursday, November 25, 1999 7:35 AM > Subject: Re: its about going deep george > > >Give it a rest George. If you want everyone on this list to believe that > you guys > >can make a 300 foot dive for 30 minutes SWIMMING on 76 cu ft of gas, that's > ok > >with me. And I am sure WE do not know how to deco too, so YOU can get by > with a > >forty of gas. (Even though I remember Jess saying he got skin bends from > your > >deco). > >I do not think anyone on this list believes this total self serving > bullshit. > > Von > > > >kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: > > > >> Jess, if you and I are diving, and we need to do a longer bottom time, > >> do we take stages, or do we convert our helium storage bottles to > >> doubles and use them. I forgot? > >> > >> If you or I hit turn, do we call the dive or do we just keep diving > >> until one of us runs out of gas ? I forgot on that one , too? > >> > >> If you and I did not actually do the dives we do, would it be ok for us > >> to get on techdiver and lie about it, and make up all kinds of stories ( > >> shark attack) and bullshit excuses about why we would not seem to know > >> anything about what were discussing? > >> > >> > >> Jess Armantrout wrote: > >> > > >> > see option 1 > >> > > >> > -----Original Message----- > >> > From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> > >> > To: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*> > >> > Cc: techdiver@aquanaut.com <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > >> > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 3:12 PM > >> > Subject: Re: its about going deep george > >> > > >> > >Jess That's great for you. Realistically how many of the multitude of > tech > >> > >divers out there breath a .25 on a swimming dive with stages? One can > be > >> > fit for > >> > >diving with moderate regular exercise and does not have to maintain an > >> > Olympic > >> > >workout to dive.What if your buddy's rate was more than your own? How > do > >> > you > >> > >calculate your safety? > >> > >Von > >> > > > >> > >Jess Armantrout wrote: > >> > > > >> > >> I'm not a hoove. That is how I am safe. I run 40 miles a week, > bike 100 > >> > >> and swim 6. My breathing rate in warm salty water on weenie dives > like > >> > this > >> > >> is less than .25, and the student's was much better than that. (We > did > >> > 100 > >> > >> minutes at 50 on a night dive and she used 1300 psi out of an > 80...what's > >> > >> that, .13?). In a cave with steels and the additional task loading, > my > >> > rate > >> > >> sky rockets to around .33, but that is scary diving. Also, we know > how > >> > to > >> > >> deco, and don't spend all day. > >> > >> > >> > >> As I have mentioned to you previously, that you can not do these > dives > >> > does > >> > >> not mean they can not be done safely. > >> > >> > >> > >> Jess > >> > >> > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> > >> From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> > >> > >> To: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>; > techdiver@aquanaut.com > >> > >> <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > >> > >> Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 1:44 PM > >> > >> Subject: Re: its about going deep george > >> > >> > >> > >> >Out of curiosity what was your mix and quantify for bottom gas and > deco > >> > >> gas? > >> > >> >At 30 min there is significant deco at 300 feet. > >> > >> >How do you bring enough gas to be safe? > >> > >> > > >> > >> >I just got back from Cayman and the temp was around 79 to 80 on the > >> > bottom. > >> > >> >I would be in a sweat box in a dry suit . > >> > >> > > >> > >> >Bill > >> > >> > > >> > >> > > >> > >> > > >> > >> >Jess Armantrout wrote: > >> > >> > > >> > >> >> Von, > >> > >> >> you're grasping, buddy. I taught a trimix course in Cayman, > several > >> > >> years > >> > >> >> ago, back when nitrox wasn't even legal there. We did 300's for > 25 to > >> > 30 > >> > >> >> all week long. Ironically, my student was the safety officer > for the > >> > >> CIWA, > >> > >> >> the organization banning Nitrox in Cayman. Since neither of us > were > >> > >> hooves, > >> > >> >> we dove twin 80's and 40's for deco gas. We were swimming. We > were > >> > >> diving > >> > >> >> wet. I dove a Halcyon 18 pound set of wings and no weight. > >> > >> >> > >> > >> >> WHAT'S THE BIG FUCKING DEAL!!!!????!!!!! > >> > >> >> > >> > >> >> -----Original Message----- > >> > >> >> From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> > >> > >> >> To: kirvine@sa*.ne* <kirvine@sa*.ne*> > >> > >> >> Cc: gordonjr <jrgordonsenior@em*.ms*.co*>; > techdiver@aquanaut.com > >> > >> >> <techdiver@aquanaut.com> > >> > >> >> Date: Tuesday, November 23, 1999 11:23 PM > >> > >> >> Subject: Re: its about going deep george > >> > >> >> > >> > >> >> >Obviously George you have never made a deep dive in the summer > in the > >> > >> >> Caribbean > >> > >> >> >or you would understand. > >> > >> >> >You still have not posted your tank/gas configuration diving wet > >> > w/out > >> > >> >> scooter at > >> > >> >> >300 much less 350, for 25 to 30 min.. > >> > >> >> >What are you so afraid of? > >> > >> >> >That there is an instant when DIR might not be exactly as the > great > >> > >> George > >> > >> >> >Grapevine dictates? > >> > >> >> >DIR does work in most instances. However there might, just might > be > >> > an > >> > >> >> >alternative that is safer for the longer exposures at depth. > i.e. > >> > >> redundant > >> > >> >> bc' > >> > >> >> >for gas availability. > >> > >> >> >By the way, studies have shown that one long exposure may be > safer > >> > than > >> > >> two > >> > >> >> >shorter ones. > >> > >> >> >Von > >> > >> >> >kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: > >> > >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> Bill, you are not only dangerous ,you are an outright liar. > There > >> > is > >> > >> no > >> > >> >> >> ocean on this planet where the water at "350" is warm. The > >> > Britannic > >> > >> is > >> > >> >> >> cold as would be expected at depth and warm at the surface as > would > >> > be > >> > >> >> >> expected in the Mediteranean. Your original argument was that > the > >> > Gulf > >> > >> >> >> is warm at the surface. The fact is you have no justification > for > >> > >> >> >> dangerous stupidity. > >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >> An unbalanced rig is open ocean the trademeark of a no-plan > >> > >> dillatante. > >> > >> >> >> This is so simple, and you do not get it. Convoluted stupidity > to > >> > >> offset > >> > >> >> >> self-inflicted risk is not the answer. > >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >> I will keep offsetting your nonsense and pointing out how > wrong you > >> > >> are. > >> > >> >> >> The difference betwen you and the guys who did the Britannic > is the > >> > >> >> >> diffrence between the real thing and bullshit. Jarrod is the > real > >> > >> thing, > >> > >> >> >> you are a yapping pretender. > >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >> Your other argument is that we do not "know wreck diving". > Well, > >> > Big > >> > >> >> >> Time, that is obviously not the case, and the fact is that it > makes > >> > no > >> > >> >> >> difference where the dive is, our methods are used by the > >> > successful > >> > >> >> >> divers, the bullshit is what the bullshitters use. You are in > the > >> > >> latter > >> > >> >> >> category. > >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >> bigvon@be*.ne* wrote: > >> > >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > Like I said before George you are a master of misdirection. > The > >> > >> >> discussion > >> > >> >> >> > was about deep warm water diving with steels without the use > of a > >> > >> >> scooter.. > >> > >> >> >> > Not cold Britannic water with drysuits and scooters. > >> > >> >> >> > You still did not answer the question tough guy and I doubt > you > >> > ever > >> > >> >> will. > >> > >> >> >> > Von > >> > >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: > >> > >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > Von, why don't you stop by GUE and straighten Jarrod out. > I > >> > tried > >> > >> to > >> > >> >> >> > > tell him that diving the Britannic in a drysuit was not > the Von > >> > >> >> method, > >> > >> >> >> > > and that since he was beyond 300, he should have had > steels and > >> > a > >> > >> >> >> > > wetsuit, a backwards bc, two bottom timers in case his arm > got > >> > bit > >> > >> >> off > >> > >> >> >> > > by a shark, etc. > >> > >> >> >> > > > >> > >> >> >> > > Maybe you can come to a WKPP dive and tell me how to do > more > >> > than > >> > >> a > >> > >> >> >> > > "bounce" dive, since I have very little experience with > the > >> > kind > >> > >> of > >> > >> >> big > >> > >> >> >> > > bottom times you are doing, and show me about "exploring" > and > >> > what > >> > >> I > >> > >> >> >> > > need to do in the way of "modifications " to accomplish > these > >> > >> feats, > >> > >> >> >> > > short of the lobotomy is appears you forgot to tell us > about. > >> > >> >> >> > > > >> > >> >> >> > > bigvon@be*.ne* wrote: > >> > >> >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> >> > > > I did laugh at THAT one. > >> > >> >> >> > > > I realize I am on the "DIR list", not techdiver. I will > >> > continue > >> > >> to > >> > >> >> >> > > > dive my way and you guys can stay above 300 and dive > your > >> > way. > >> > >> No > >> > >> >> one > >> > >> >> >> > > > has addressed the deep issue. I am not advocating deep > >> > diving, > >> > >> just > >> > >> >> >> > > > commenting on a style that is safe. You WKPP guys keep > >> > bouncing > >> > >> the > >> > >> >> >> > > > wrecks and we will keep exploring them. > >> > >> >> >> > > > Von > >> > >> >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> >> > > > gordonjr wrote: > >> > >> >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> >> > > > Von, You place your backup wing on upside down, > strap > >> > the > >> > >> >> >> > > > inflator to your waist strap, and orally inflate at > >> > waist > >> > >> >> >> > > > level?Hell, if I could do that I'd never leave the > house > >> > >> >> >> > > > (credits to G.Carlin). JR Gordon "Just flip the > BC > >> > over > >> > >> >> >> > > > and place it over the bolts as you do your primary > B.C. > >> > >> >> >> > > > I loop a small loop of small bungie over the bottom > bolt > >> > >> >> >> > > > before I assemble the > >> > >> >> >> > > > harness. This loop is placed over the power > inflator > >> > >> >> >> > > > mechanism to secure it at > >> > >> >> >> > > > your right waist. There is no hose run to the > inflator. > >> > >> Just > >> > >> >> >> > > > orally inflate if > >> > >> >> >> > > > needed." > >> > >> >> >> > > > >> > >> >> >> > > -- > >> > >> >> >> > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > >> > >> >> `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > >> > >> >> >> > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > >> > >> >> `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > >> > >> >> > > >> > >> >> >-- > >> > >> >> >Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > >> > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > >> > >> >> >Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > >> > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > >> > >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. > >> > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > > -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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