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wrong, scumbag, I got skinbends from being dehydrated (and thus stupid) after hiking through the mexican jungle for 7 kilometers followed by a 350' dive. When is the last time you covered 7 kilometers in anything other than a car? Talk about give it a rest, you've got everybody and their brother coming on here and telling you you're an idiot, even guys that have no association with George and/or the WKPP. Do you think that maybe, just maybe, you are indeed an idiot after all? -----Original Message----- From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> To: kirvine@sa*.ne* <kirvine@sa*.ne*> Cc: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>; techdiver@aquanaut.com <techdiver@aquanaut.com> Date: Thursday, November 25, 1999 7:35 AM Subject: Re: its about going deep george >Give it a rest George. If you want everyone on this list to believe that you guys >can make a 300 foot dive for 30 minutes SWIMMING on 76 cu ft of gas, that's ok >with me. And I am sure WE do not know how to deco too, so YOU can get by with a >forty of gas. (Even though I remember Jess saying he got skin bends from your >deco). >I do not think anyone on this list believes this total self serving bullshit. > Von > >kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: > >> Jess, if you and I are diving, and we need to do a longer bottom time, >> do we take stages, or do we convert our helium storage bottles to >> doubles and use them. I forgot? >> >> If you or I hit turn, do we call the dive or do we just keep diving >> until one of us runs out of gas ? I forgot on that one , too? >> >> If you and I did not actually do the dives we do, would it be ok for us >> to get on techdiver and lie about it, and make up all kinds of stories ( >> shark attack) and bullshit excuses about why we would not seem to know >> anything about what were discussing? >> >> >> Jess Armantrout wrote: >> > >> > see option 1 >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> >> > To: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*> >> > Cc: techdiver@aquanaut.com <techdiver@aquanaut.com> >> > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 3:12 PM >> > Subject: Re: its about going deep george >> > >> > >Jess That's great for you. Realistically how many of the multitude of tech >> > >divers out there breath a .25 on a swimming dive with stages? One can be >> > fit for >> > >diving with moderate regular exercise and does not have to maintain an >> > Olympic >> > >workout to dive.What if your buddy's rate was more than your own? How do >> > you >> > >calculate your safety? >> > >Von >> > > >> > >Jess Armantrout wrote: >> > > >> > >> I'm not a hoove. That is how I am safe. I run 40 miles a week, bike 100 >> > >> and swim 6. My breathing rate in warm salty water on weenie dives like >> > this >> > >> is less than .25, and the student's was much better than that. (We did >> > 100 >> > >> minutes at 50 on a night dive and she used 1300 psi out of an 80...what's >> > >> that, .13?). In a cave with steels and the additional task loading, my >> > rate >> > >> sky rockets to around .33, but that is scary diving. Also, we know how >> > to >> > >> deco, and don't spend all day. >> > >> >> > >> As I have mentioned to you previously, that you can not do these dives >> > does >> > >> not mean they can not be done safely. >> > >> >> > >> Jess >> > >> >> > >> -----Original Message----- >> > >> From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> >> > >> To: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>; techdiver@aquanaut.com >> > >> <techdiver@aquanaut.com> >> > >> Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 1:44 PM >> > >> Subject: Re: its about going deep george >> > >> >> > >> >Out of curiosity what was your mix and quantify for bottom gas and deco >> > >> gas? >> > >> >At 30 min there is significant deco at 300 feet. >> > >> >How do you bring enough gas to be safe? >> > >> > >> > >> >I just got back from Cayman and the temp was around 79 to 80 on the >> > bottom. >> > >> >I would be in a sweat box in a dry suit . >> > >> > >> > >> >Bill >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >Jess Armantrout wrote: >> > >> > >> > >> >> Von, >> > >> >> you're grasping, buddy. I taught a trimix course in Cayman, several >> > >> years >> > >> >> ago, back when nitrox wasn't even legal there. We did 300's for 25 to >> > 30 >> > >> >> all week long. Ironically, my student was the safety officer for the >> > >> CIWA, >> > >> >> the organization banning Nitrox in Cayman. Since neither of us were >> > >> hooves, >> > >> >> we dove twin 80's and 40's for deco gas. We were swimming. We were >> > >> diving >> > >> >> wet. I dove a Halcyon 18 pound set of wings and no weight. >> > >> >> >> > >> >> WHAT'S THE BIG FUCKING DEAL!!!!????!!!!! >> > >> >> >> > >> >> -----Original Message----- >> > >> >> From: bigvon@be*.ne* <bigvon@be*.ne*> >> > >> >> To: kirvine@sa*.ne* <kirvine@sa*.ne*> >> > >> >> Cc: gordonjr <jrgordonsenior@em*.ms*.co*>; techdiver@aquanaut.com >> > >> >> <techdiver@aquanaut.com> >> > >> >> Date: Tuesday, November 23, 1999 11:23 PM >> > >> >> Subject: Re: its about going deep george >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >Obviously George you have never made a deep dive in the summer in the >> > >> >> Caribbean >> > >> >> >or you would understand. >> > >> >> >You still have not posted your tank/gas configuration diving wet >> > w/out >> > >> >> scooter at >> > >> >> >300 much less 350, for 25 to 30 min.. >> > >> >> >What are you so afraid of? >> > >> >> >That there is an instant when DIR might not be exactly as the great >> > >> George >> > >> >> >Grapevine dictates? >> > >> >> >DIR does work in most instances. However there might, just might be >> > an >> > >> >> >alternative that is safer for the longer exposures at depth. i.e. >> > >> redundant >> > >> >> bc' >> > >> >> >for gas availability. >> > >> >> >By the way, studies have shown that one long exposure may be safer >> > than >> > >> two >> > >> >> >shorter ones. >> > >> >> >Von >> > >> >> >kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: >> > >> >> > >> > >> >> >> Bill, you are not only dangerous ,you are an outright liar. There >> > is >> > >> no >> > >> >> >> ocean on this planet where the water at "350" is warm. The >> > Britannic >> > >> is >> > >> >> >> cold as would be expected at depth and warm at the surface as would >> > be >> > >> >> >> expected in the Mediteranean. Your original argument was that the >> > Gulf >> > >> >> >> is warm at the surface. The fact is you have no justification for >> > >> >> >> dangerous stupidity. >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> An unbalanced rig is open ocean the trademeark of a no-plan >> > >> dillatante. >> > >> >> >> This is so simple, and you do not get it. Convoluted stupidity to >> > >> offset >> > >> >> >> self-inflicted risk is not the answer. >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> I will keep offsetting your nonsense and pointing out how wrong you >> > >> are. >> > >> >> >> The difference betwen you and the guys who did the Britannic is the >> > >> >> >> diffrence between the real thing and bullshit. Jarrod is the real >> > >> thing, >> > >> >> >> you are a yapping pretender. >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> Your other argument is that we do not "know wreck diving". Well, >> > Big >> > >> >> >> Time, that is obviously not the case, and the fact is that it makes >> > no >> > >> >> >> difference where the dive is, our methods are used by the >> > successful >> > >> >> >> divers, the bullshit is what the bullshitters use. You are in the >> > >> latter >> > >> >> >> category. >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> bigvon@be*.ne* wrote: >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >> > Like I said before George you are a master of misdirection. The >> > >> >> discussion >> > >> >> >> > was about deep warm water diving with steels without the use of a >> > >> >> scooter.. >> > >> >> >> > Not cold Britannic water with drysuits and scooters. >> > >> >> >> > You still did not answer the question tough guy and I doubt you >> > ever >> > >> >> will. >> > >> >> >> > Von >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >> > kirvine@sa*.ne* wrote: >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> >> >> > > Von, why don't you stop by GUE and straighten Jarrod out. I >> > tried >> > >> to >> > >> >> >> > > tell him that diving the Britannic in a drysuit was not the Von >> > >> >> method, >> > >> >> >> > > and that since he was beyond 300, he should have had steels and >> > a >> > >> >> >> > > wetsuit, a backwards bc, two bottom timers in case his arm got >> > bit >> > >> >> off >> > >> >> >> > > by a shark, etc. >> > >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > Maybe you can come to a WKPP dive and tell me how to do more >> > than >> > >> a >> > >> >> >> > > "bounce" dive, since I have very little experience with the >> > kind >> > >> of >> > >> >> big >> > >> >> >> > > bottom times you are doing, and show me about "exploring" and >> > what >> > >> I >> > >> >> >> > > need to do in the way of "modifications " to accomplish these >> > >> feats, >> > >> >> >> > > short of the lobotomy is appears you forgot to tell us about. >> > >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > bigvon@be*.ne* wrote: >> > >> >> >> > > > >> > >> >> >> > > > I did laugh at THAT one. >> > >> >> >> > > > I realize I am on the "DIR list", not techdiver. I will >> > continue >> > >> to >> > >> >> >> > > > dive my way and you guys can stay above 300 and dive your >> > way. >> > >> No >> > >> >> one >> > >> >> >> > > > has addressed the deep issue. I am not advocating deep >> > diving, >> > >> just >> > >> >> >> > > > commenting on a style that is safe. You WKPP guys keep >> > bouncing >> > >> the >> > >> >> >> > > > wrecks and we will keep exploring them. >> > >> >> >> > > > Von >> > >> >> >> > > > >> > >> >> >> > > > gordonjr wrote: >> > >> >> >> > > > >> > >> >> >> > > > Von, You place your backup wing on upside down, strap >> > the >> > >> >> >> > > > inflator to your waist strap, and orally inflate at >> > waist >> > >> >> >> > > > level?Hell, if I could do that I'd never leave the house >> > >> >> >> > > > (credits to G.Carlin). JR Gordon "Just flip the BC >> > over >> > >> >> >> > > > and place it over the bolts as you do your primary B.C. >> > >> >> >> > > > I loop a small loop of small bungie over the bottom bolt >> > >> >> >> > > > before I assemble the >> > >> >> >> > > > harness. This loop is placed over the power inflator >> > >> >> >> > > > mechanism to secure it at >> > >> >> >> > > > your right waist. There is no hose run to the inflator. >> > >> Just >> > >> >> >> > > > orally inflate if >> > >> >> >> > > > needed." >> > >> >> >> > > >> > >> >> >> > > -- >> > >> >> >> > > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to >> > >> >> `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. >> > >> >> >> > > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to >> > >> >> `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. >> > >> >> > >> > >> >> >-- >> > >> >> >Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to >> > `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. >> > >> >> >Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to >> > `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. >> > >> > >> > > >> > >> > -- >> > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. >> > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'. > -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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