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George,
Do you ever wonder why people don't follow what you preach
or are reluctant to post information on diving fatalities? It's because
they have to read crap from you in return for posting information.
Charlie didn't die because he was diving the Doria.
Charlie didn't die because he was wearing a pony bottle.
Charlie didn't die from the wrong mix in any of his tanks.
Charlie didn't die from not having a buddy going up the anchor line.
Charlie probably died from a CO2 hit. This death could have
happened just as easily in a cave in Florida swimming against an
out flow current, or doing a dive off Ft. Lauderdale trying to swim
against the Gulf Stream current. Obviously a buddy might have
been able to save him but there are certainly no guarantees.
George, why don't you direct your energy toward explaining the
increased risk of a CO2 hit from over exertion while wearing
doubles, stages, dry suit while trying to swim against a current?
Who knows, maybe you could prevent a future death by explaining
the cause, symptoms, and treatment for excessive CO2 build up!
On second thought, don't say anything. They are more likely
to listen to me because I'm not yelling at them.
To the Techdiver Forum:
There is a high probability that Charlie died as a result of a CO2
hit which resulted in unconsciousness and finally drowning.
When diving it is imperative not to over exert yourself for an
extended period of time. Excessive exertion such as swimming
against a current, combined with uncontrollable rapid shallow
breathing may indicate an excessive CO2 build in your body. If the
exertion is not halted immediately and breathing brought under
control, the diver may experience a CO2 hit which refers to
"blacking out". Drowning will likely occur unless your buddy is able
bring you to the surface and resuscitate you.
Ted
From: kirvine@sa*.ne*
Mike, the only reason for using a pony is abject stupidity, and the
only reason they all skipped order it in their reports of the
accidents is that they do not want to hurt anyones' feelings. The
carnage will continueuntil the smart guys just say "NO" to the boat
monkees, and some of the worst boat monkess up there are the
most entrenched big shots - in ourworld they are called STROKES,
and in my opinion it is their stupidity that is accountable for the
death toll directly or indirectly.
If I were doing what I do and recommending dangerous stupid
practices, I would be as criminal as these guys are. The only
difference is I know better, I learn, I recognize when I am wrong and
fix it, and I admit it and point it out. These half wits are incapable of
any of this. Boy , would I love to get some of these strokes in the
water to show them jsut how bad they really are, since people
dying around them does not have any impact.
From: <kirvine@sa*.ne*>
> Ted, there has never been a manifold failure, and the mode of failure is
> to lose the knob with a freeflwoing reg and no isolator - solution is
> "buddy", a dirty word up there.
>
> The ari pony or any pony is so stupid and so ridicoulous as to not
> merrit anything but laugter, if it were not for the track record at
> hand.
>
> I dive further into caves than most of these wrecks are offshore, and I
> have no pony bottle - that is patently absurd. If they are scared, and
> do not trust the buddy, maybe they need to carry a buddy bottle of
> proper mix as a stage, but this is also total bullshit. They need to
> start doing it right.
>
> Secondly, these guys have bullshit rigs and do not know how to operate
> as buddies, and that is why the are having problems. Quit defending
> these morons. You are in the business, and it is your ass they are
> kicking , not mine. I dive wherever and whenever I want no matter how
> badly the rest of the world screws up, as evidenced by the fact that
> they let us back into Wakulla after the Stone Fiasco, and they asked
> Jarrod to come do the Britannic.
>
> Ted ,these guys are idiots - they need a wakeup call, and obviously no
> number of deaths is going to do the trick. They need to get banned from
> diving out there to make the point.
>
>
> Ted Green wrote:
> >
> > George,
> > While I am not a proponent of this practise, divers who put a 30
> > or 40 cuft. pony on the back of their doubles, do so to have a
> > completely independent source of gas. The reason for this they
> > claim is that if you strike the isolator and break the manifold
> > causing a rapid gas loss, there probably will not be a knob left to
> > close the isolator down with. This practice is a hold over from
> > single outlet doubles.
> >
> > As to the cause of Charlie's death; I talked to one of the mates
> > on the boat a week after Charlie's death. He said that Charlie had
> > lost the travel line that runs from the point of entry to the anchor
> > line. Instead of surfacing and regaining the line, he swam against
> > the current to the anchor line and had to let go of the anchor line
> > several times on his descent to go around divers hanging on the
> > line. The mate felt that Charlie over exerted himself trying to catch
> > up to one of his two buddies and swimming against the current. By
> > the time he reached 165', he may have had a massive CO2
> > headache. He signalled to his buddies he was aborting the dive,
> > and blackout on the way up.
> >
> > While all the crap that has been posted over the last few weeks
> > may have been possible. I believe that a CO2 hit is a more likely
> > explanation for him aborting the dive at 165' and blacking out on the
> > way up.
> >
> > Ted
> >
> > From: <kirvine@sa*.ne*>
> > Subject: Re: Petting the Air Pony: was Re: Doria Deaths -
Let's dive some air
> >
> >
> > > Maybe also we could get one of the rocket scientist up there to tell us
> > > why ponying a bottle behind your back with the bottle turned on with the
> > > reg over your shoulder mixed in with the other two makes any sense, and
> > > why trying to combine a totally unnecessary bailout, a suit inflation,
> > > and a travel gas all in one where the gas in question, AIR, is not the
> > > right gas for any of those applications, and why it is a good idea to
> > > put a reg on an inflation bottle , why we need a pony with a dual port
> > > manifold, why we need it behind us, why it should be AIR, and why nobody
> > > up there has ever bothered to question any of this nonsense.
> >
> > --
> > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
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>
> --
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