Phi Le  wrote on Monday, October 19, 1998 5:21 PM : -


>Nicki-san,


Your usage of the Japanese honorific, "san" must be deemed incorrect as
neither you (the speaker) nor I (the addressee) are Japanese.  I'm Cantonese
and you are, I presume, of Vietnamese or Cambodian extraction.


>Let me 'wet' my humour a bit, since you have none and didn't really
>understand any subtleties... And pardon my spelling and grammar, I am so
>used to speak to Singaporeans since I have moved here.


I'm afraid that, thus far, your attempt at dry, subtle humour is lost on me.
My fellow Singaporeans may well take umbrage at your undeserved compliment
on their alleged influence on your spelling and grammar.  I, on the other
hand, will take the charitable view that your linguistic frailties might be
due, in part, to the influence of "the bunch of guys ... out for some fun
diving" of whom you've alluded to earlier and with whom you seem to be in
the company of these days.


>I don't really care about who you are referring to as 'the jury', nor do I
>care what 'they' think,

The jury, as always, consist of the list's subscribers.  Don't be too hasty;
you might *just* change your mind; especially, if the "verdict" is in your
favour.


I have *never* stated that the IANTD Instructor
>Trainers were a bunch of strokes, nor have I stated that the TDI divers
were
>better divers. You have made that assumption. I have simply repeated some
>facts posted by the IANTD SE Asia Instructor Trainer, and pointed out an
>error.

Not expressly perhaps.  However, you do seem to have assumed the worst
possible permutation[s] based on the information which has been, perhaps
inadequately, presented in Khoo's post.  For example, you seem to have
suggested that *everyone* on Khoo's trip had dove on *air* to *67metres* ,
with *120s* and *steel stages*, with *3 mm suits*, on *Apollo scooters*.  A
deliberate or an unwitting use of "reductio ad absurdum" on your part,
perhaps?  I wonder why.

The facts.  Heresay, I'm afraid as I wasn't there.   I *have been informed*
that the dive to 67 metres was on trimix.  Those diving the 120s were using
the DUIs with aluminium stages.  The Apollo wasn't even used on the 67-metre
dive.


That's when you made it your business to bud in even though you have
>no part of anything going on with the IANTD nor the TDI groups, and have
not
>been on either dive trips (Do you dive ?). I have distinguished perfectly
>well between the posts, just wondering why you have any problem with what I
>wrote ?


Sorry for being a stickler, but you do mean "butt" instead of "bud", don't
you?  You shouldn't always spell according to how you pronounce a word, you
know.

Do I have locus standi to participate? As a diver? On a thread which alludes
to [un]safe diving practices on this list?  As some Americans are wont to
say, "gimme a break, please".


>It's irrelevant what the TDI guys have done on their trip.

**[Un]fortunately, there are those on this list (which does not necessarily
include me) who will opine that the following are a bunch of strokes (not
necessarily in order of strokery) : -
(i)    TDI
(ii)    Personal preference gear devotees/
(iii)    Users of OMS wings/Superwings/steel cylinders and stages
(iv)    Nitrox 80 as deco gas.

And that to some, those who do dive with strokes have violated Rule # 1.

So it may not be *that* irrelevant after all.


>They didn't get on the list and beat their chest that they have done
something that nobody
>has done,

What appears to be chest-thumping to some may well appear to be otherwise to
others.  It's all a question of perspective and giving the subject the
benefit of the doubt.


>especially it is *not* true (ship artifacts were missing would you
>a clue that *someone* was there before you).

Not to put too fine a point on it, I think you have *again* failed to
differentiate Khoo's post from mine.


>It was simply a bunch of student divers went out with their instructors for
some training dives.

The said "bunch of guys .... out for some fun diving" alluded to in your
earlier post have now, voila, at a touch of the keyboard, become "a bunch of
student divers  .. out for some [fun?] training dives", perhaps.


>Unfortunately, it was on the same wrecks that the IANTD Instructor Trainers
>were to do their exploration dives weeks later.


No comment required.


>Don't try to change the subject matter by dragging equipment configurations
>between the groups. FYI, there are more DIR divers and equipment with the
>TDI groups than IANTD. Trust me, I advise you not to tread where you might
>regret later.


Interestingly enough, I have been informed by the TDI expedition leader that
several of his divers are using Halcyon backplates with OMS wings, or
considering bungying the Halcyon wings with the backplate.

If I have misheard,  I stand corrected and my sincere apologies to those
wrongly and unintentionally maligned.


>Don't drag the rest of the TDI guys in here, I am speaking for myself since
>I was there (unlike you).

Please see my comments highlighted by the use of 2 asterisks,  "**", above.


And please don't assume any superiority by
>'granting' me the option of silence.


Not at all.  Only perhaps an adverse inference to some (not necessarily, me)
that you might have violated Rule # 1.


>BTW, you would use a travel gas for diving to 60m on trimix, don't you Nick
>the trimix-diver ?


An "ad hominem" taunt? Please re-read my earlier post.  The use of the
phrase in parenthesis, "[if any]" in relation to travel or deco gas in an
open question would have been self-explanatory, I would have thought.


>Go diving instead of keep trying to kiss Khoo's ass.


I'll try - going diving - I mean.   As for the latter recommendation, which
is very "subtly" put I must say, I'll pass, as Khoo can fight his own
battles.


To end, Phi, food for thought.  Is education/diving a zerosome game (eg. TDI
vs IANTD vs GUE, Hogarthian vs DIR vs personal preference vs "the usual
suspects" etc)?  Are divers themselves the last line of defence in
education/diving (read eg Zimmerman's posts, with whom I'm in absolute
agreement )?  The agencies? Manufacturers? Project leaders?

As, I'm going to "submerge" myself in work for the coming weeks on an
"extended bottom time", without a fair opportunity to "surface" to reply to
your post[s], if any, I humbly ask that you grant me, in Lord Denning's
words, "the last shot" on the matters I've referred to in this post.


Respectfully yours,

Nick,
Singapore

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