>Dan,
>
>You seem to deal in absolutes when it comes to fitness and overweight
>conditions in a diver. Black and white, either you are, or you aren't. This
is
>not actually based on fact, but your own experience. History is written the
>same way. We will never know what actually happened in the past, because it
>was recorded by humans, hence we can only know what happened by how that
>particular individual perceived the event, the reason for todays heated
>debates over what is actually fact.

Chill out.
My agenda is helping to take a new sport, with a great future, into a safer
sport than it is right now. This MUST be done, since we are already seeing
the effects of mass marketing of tech diving to the public.  Standards need
to adress this. Unless you have missed everything I've been discussing with
Tom Mount so far, the idea was to take the VO2max concept---AND TO TEST IT
!!! I NEVER said to adopt it "as is".  We want to do chamber simulations,
and try to increase the science that is now applied to our sport.   You
should not have a problem with this. If I'm totally right, this will be of
great value to many people over the next decade. If I'm partially right, it
will still be of good value.  If I'm as totally wrong as "you" suggest I am,
I may still help some overweight divers to attain higher fitness levels, to
enjoy other elements of their life more, and to increase their general
health and well being.

>
>Does fat=slob as you propose?
>
>Does fat in fact = poorly conditioned for diving? I would love to see you
>prove that. I am 6'1" 210 lbs, and know divers far shorter and heavier than
me
>that are easily as fit, or more fit. I don't believe you can show any
research
>that directly correlates body fat as it relates to level of fitness.

You are taking me out of context---the slob reference was added to obese, as
another contributing factor. Fat is not good for offgassing. Lazy people or
those who will not work out by choice, will represent the "slob" idea here
 even thought this is not strictly a fair generalization----but I don't have
the time to be politically correct in everything I write). So the "slob" has
zero aerobic capacity and poor perfusion. This plus fat  EQUALS  an unfit
diver at much greater risk than an ultra fit diver----potentially making
someone like George safe at 300 feet for 30 minutes with the same safety
standard as the "fat" + "slob"  has at 150 feet.   ......And, ANY sports
physiologist, will tell you that high bodyfat levels correlate with LOW VO2
max scores, and much lower aerobic fitness. Obviously, you have never even
tried any endurance sports, with a crack like this.

>
>An overweight person should run a more conservative deco program, is there
a
>problem with that? Does this mean he should not dive?
>
>Where are your facts? I find quite a few accusations and attacks being made
on
>this forum, not being supported by fact. Looking at it historically, this
is
>my perception.
>
>Propoganda has been and will be used used again many times in history by
>groups trying to control and subvert the masses to their way of thinking,
or
>to have them subscribe to their agenda. This has always been done by
telling
>half truths and falsehoods about the competition. I believe that certain
>groups or individuals on this forum do exactly this, and have orchestrated
it
>well in advance to putting it into motion. I believe all the manufacturer
>bashing and agency bashing has been done and continues to be done to
support
>the underlying agenda of moving a new manufacturer and new certification
>agency to the forefront of the tec community. Can anyone guess who this new
>agency and manufacturer are? I thought you could.

If this were true, then why would I be trying to help Tom Mount with IANTD,
and including him in our discussions and testing plans. I think IANTD has
what it takes.  I think TDI will always be a lost cause, as long as they
have poster boys like Gilliam doing his thing.  And of course, since we feel
stongly that a safer system must be created for certification, we are
reaching out to anyone we know, who has the requisite ability, to add a
needed component to tech and cave diving. If you think this is wrong, you
are living in the wrong country, and the wrong time.

As to the manufacturer, I assume you are referring to Halcyon, who has been
building equipment for WKPP for years now. In case you did not know, WKPP
has always been a non-profit organization. They needed safer and better
equipment to dive Wakulla than was available, and Halcyon stepped up to the
plate---creating some of the best equipment the tech or cave world has yet
seen.   How many people in the tech and cave arena, would want WKPP, or me,
to hide this safer and better equipment from the world, to keep it only for
ourselves, because of some kind of elitist idealism???

A few years back, the moron, Stone, announced to the world he had penetrated
into Wakulla as far as you could go on conventional open circuit scuba.
George and the WKPP group proceeded to triple Stone's record, using
conventional style open circuit gear, much of it created for them by
Halcyon.
I ask you again. Should we keep this gear only to ourselves??? I don't think
that it would be right to do so, but on the other hand, we have done nothing
to "infomercial" the tech or cavers list with Halcyon propaganda. We have
let some people know this is the gear the WKPP  uses, to do dives that NO
ONE ELSE CAN DO....!  We have not made it a secret, and we have not started
any PR campaign about Halcyon either.

So why is it, that you now, want to keep WKPP gear choices an unknown to the
tech and cave worlds??? If this is not your agenda, than why are you trying
to create this ridiculous, "Conspiracy Theory"????  Have you been watching
too much Jerry Springer??? ( incidentally, I heard this show just had a 1600
pound woman on it----do you think she should be given the chance to tech
dive in her current condition???--she probably could move around in the
water much better than she can roll around on her bed ----we are sending her
a Brett Gilliam poster :).

>
>It's a pity a group cannot market their product and ideas based on it's
>laurels, quality, and innovation, and at the same time, show some respect
for
>the competition, and the individual. If you do not agree with training
>techniques, or gear design, spend your energy educating the consumer about
>your way, and why it is better, not trashing everyone that stands in your
way.

I've spent a huge amount of time trying to pave the way for better training
and safer certification proceedures. How have you been helping lately? And
WKPP did an entire video on proper gear configuration---the "Doing it Right"
video.  If you are as intelligent as you think you are, you should find it
compelling.


>On the list of reasons the group perished in WPB was that the diver was
>wearing OMS bondage wings, how absurd, I have still not heard a valid
reason
>why there are claims that they will not fully inflate at depth, and I am
still
>waiting. This is just a small example of the propoganda program in place
>against all who stand in the way of their domination. Money and power make
>people do strange things.
>
>Thank God we have our own minds, and the gift to think for ourselves.

I don't know where you've been...So you did not here about the test done by
WKPP divers with OMS bondage style wings??? The bungees constricted the
expansion of the bladder, causing the overpressure relief valve to release
air far before proper lift capacity was reached. Bungee configurations
frequently seen used by the tech community, typically yielded lift
capacities of 30 to 35 pounds, and some set ups of the bungee system yielded
considerably less. Its a "techy" look, driven by ad guys----marketing made
this a seller in dive shops, not function.  Now guys like you are trying to
ignore the real issue of function, and tell the world all dive gear is good.
Funny thing Kevin...all dive gear is NOT good.  Some of it can be dangerous,
particularly if matched to other gear that is far from ideal for the dive
"mission" as well...i.e., wetsuits at 250 feet in 50 degree
water-----wetsuits at 250 matched to 4 steel 98's and their huge negative
bouyancy----and low lift BC's.

Kevin, if your mind generated the ideas you posted here, you have very
little to thank god for in the way of your own thinking ability.
Dan.

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