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Date: Mon, 7 Oct 1996 09:06:18 -1000 (HST)
From: Richard Pyle <deepreef@bi*.bi*.ha*.or*>
To: "Kevin W. Juergensen" <heyydude@pi*.co*>
Cc: Peter Heseltine <heseltin@hs*.us*.ed*>, techdiver@terra.net
Subject: Re: Gas margin, safety with rebreathers (fwd)

> First off - I am convinced that, with proper training, and rigorous
> maintenance, a closed circuit rebreather will keep you alive in SEVERAL
> different ways.  I've said this before, and I'll say it again.  When
> something goes wrong in open circuit - you've got one option- Get more Gas.
> When something goes wrong with a rebreather (like mine, since I know no
> others) - you have SEVERAL different options at your disposal.  You've also
> got MINUTES to figure out the problem, as opposed to SECONDS in open
> circuit.  I don't have to tell you that that can mean the difference
> between life and death.

Well stated, dude!  The only caveat is that you need to recoginize there
is a problem before you can spend those minutes deciding how best to 
solve it.  The fundamental barrier to rebreathers for the masses
is that the killers (too much O2, too little O2) are insideous - i.e., not
self-evident. Lights out comes with no obvious forewarning (jury is still 
out on the CO2 issues).  With SCUBA, pretty much any of the real killers 
(except a bad fill, or pilot error in grabbing the wrong reg at the wrong 
depth) are self-evident - you have some warning before you go under.  
With rebreathers, you need to stay on top of the O2 in the loop. That's 
why I keep hammering on the "D" word (discipline).  Given the discipline, 
I think you are absolutely right on the fact that with CC, you tend to 
have multiple options to solve problems, and that you have several 
minutes to several hours of "margin for error" time to work out the best 
solution.

> To say that rebreathers DON'T offer safety advantages to the trained diver
> is ludicrous, and simply identifies the person stating that as a
> non-rebreather diver.  This is not meant as an insult, simply a statement
> of fact.  Once you get a closed circuit rebreather, you will see just how
> much they can do for you in terms of safer deco, safer gas managment, and
> safer unsupported solo diving.

Again, well-said.

> Not only that, but you have got the POTENTIAL for sooooo much bottom time,
> that if you were stuck in a wreck (which was the subject talked about in
> the previous posts), lets say at 130' - you've got probably 4-5 hours to
> figure a way to get out.  Think about that.  Four to Five HOURS.  Maybe
> more, depending upon whether or not you started the dive with full spheres
> and new scrubber, and if you listened to Rod and plumbed your unit with
> combo bailout/extra diluent bottle.

Even more if your canister was flood-proof, so that you could use LiOH, 
and if you plumbed in a 2nd O2 supply.  I have the potential to put 
20 hours (plus or minus, depending on workload) of life-support on my back 
in a package that is smaller & lighter than a set of double 72's...but I 
digress.

> And let me say here that most of the guys that keep harping about
> "electronic devices" in life support equipment are NOT rebreather divers.
> I used to ask Rod and John a bunch of stupid questions, born of concerns I
> had BEFORE I owned my unit and was properly trained on it.  Once I got
> mine, and learned in detail its functions and design, I stopped worrying
> about the electronics and other stupid stuff like that.

Like I've always said:  electronics on a well-designed rebreather are NOT 
life-support equipment!

> Truth be told, the damn thing is really a beauty of simple engineering.
> Nothing fancy, no multiple integrated circuits, no complex wiring.  Hell,
> you could probably go to Radio Shack and build the circuits for the
> CCR-155.  There is nothing in these units that does not serve some SIMPLE
> function.  This is why us BioMarine divers chuckle at some of the proposed
> designs of other manufacturers.  Why re-invent the wheel?  Figure a way to
> copy the BioMarine design, and go with that.

Hmmm...I think I'll let that one slide -- just because I know that, deep 
down, you are really jealous. ;-)

etc....all good stuff.

Aloha,
Rich

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