Mailing List Archive

Mailing List: techdiver

Banner Advert

Message Display

Date: Sun, 17 Mar 1996 22:47:38 -0800
From: Trey Irvine <gmiiii@in*.co*>
Subject: anonomous bullshitRe: George Irvine
To: techdiver@terra.net, cavers@ge*.co*

   Mark, there are no divers with WKPP who do any of the exploration diving
that 
do it any other way, except when sidemounting. You mention Mark Long et al .
Why 
is it that we go to the same caves, like Manatee, and have the end of the line 
and all of the "long" stuff , and they have all of the close in stuff? Explain 
that. Casey and I routinely add line in places like that with no support team
at 
all .

    Bill Gavin and I put the end in Turner (a 285 syphon) with no support
divers 
or anyone else even present. We did most of the Cheryl dives with no team. 

    The fact is that the "methods" of the people you mention are just plain 
random, and are no methods at all. They use makeshift gear, they have no real 
scooter because they do not know how to build one. They do not even know how to 
use a tekna properly, like we did in Manatee. None of them needs mixed gas for 
what they do. You say they do "deep" dives - yeah, right. They do no 
penetrations worth mentioning, and don't tell me about their years of effort to 
go nowhere in Madison Blue after Bill Main put the end in on a swim dive years 
ago.

      These guys are doing weenie dives that require no special skill, no 
special equipment, and no special knowledge, training or physical fitness, and 
holding court with the neophytes and each other to make it sound like a big
deal 
-this is not modesty on their part, it is ralism.Comparing them to us is an 
outright insult, and you know it or you would not use the anonomous mailer.

      We don't care what excuses you make for doing things like slopily. Saying 
that you are just doing a little dive does not justify being unsafe and is 
little consolation for being less than optimal. I would do nothing that way,
you 
guys would and do, and that is the difference between me and and the divers you 
mentioned.

       If you can't put out a real post, then your point is lost. The reason
you 
do not hear anything from these guys is that they have nothing to say, are 
inarticulate when they think they do, and in the case of Hires are in the 
"business" and have little or no choice about what they say or do. The guy who 
photgraphed the sinkhole at Lamar and Woody's last dive for the cover of UWS 
spends his talents writing letters to the NSS asking them to revoke WKPP's 
project status while themselves contributing nothing of the proportions that we 
do.

       We have invited anyone who wants to do things according to our rules, 
which is the only way they will be done at our sites, to come and particiapte
in 
our projects. 70 people have done so. You can not say that for any other 
organization or group in diving.

        My discussion of our methods is legitimate, and mostly in response to 
questions by people who see us having all ogf the fun and making it look easy, 
not as a means to get them to make you guys look stupid, which is how you are 
taking it, and frankly, what the obvious result is - this is not intentional.

        Tell us what is so right about Woody Jasper's gear, or the rest of
these 
guys , and tell me why if they are so proficient, that they can not put
together 
any kind of exploration or organization, produce no maps , no results , no 
information, nothing to benefit the ecology , etc.    

         All these guys do is hold court to anyone who is dumb enough to
listen, 
hide caves from you people, and keep the good old boy network alive and well. 
They will never do anything for you , they will never take you diving anywhere 
worth diving, and they will try to tell you they have been diving for twenty 
years and are the best, that we don't exist, that we are dangerous, that we 
cheat on gas, that we have special equipment that they do not have. Since I was 
born with my pair, I have to beg to differ.

          We do exactly the opposite. Let me remind you who the exploration 
divers are for WKPP: Irvine, Irving, Jablonski, Mackinlay, Sankey, Scarabin. 
Bill Gavin is inactive for the last six months. When you see one of these guys 
doing it the wrong way, I will kiss your ass in Macy's window.

                    - GMI3

Navigate by Author: [Previous] [Next] [Author Search Index]
Navigate by Subject: [Previous] [Next] [Subject Search Index]

[Send Reply] [Send Message with New Topic]

[Search Selection] [Mailing List Home] [Home]