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Subject: Re: Enough of this PGP nonsense
To: gmiiii@in*.co* (George M. Irvine III)
Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 09:20:03 -0500 (EST)
Cc: cavers@ge*.co*, techdiver@terra.net (techdiver)
From: zimmmt@au*.al*.co* (Mike Zimmerman)
>   Then stop fighting George's battle for him.  He's the one who
>         ----------------- 
>      Mike, you guys don't get it , do you? If you are enough of an asshole to 
> attack Sankey, I will stuff it donw your throat. Our irritation with all of
you 
> guys is the fact that all of you want to argue with us, 

No George, it is you that doesn't get it.  Please find *ANY* post
of mine where I argue with the WKPP dive techniques.  Can't find one 
huh?  What you will find over the past months is me posting mostly 
for 2 reasons:

-asking that people try and maintain some semblance of civility
-asking that all the damn fake messages stop

Now if either of these two requests seems to attack the WKPP then
that's your problem.  Frankly unless somehow the WKPP is responsible
for either of the two above things, then I can't see how they
should feel attacked.  

Also don't lump me with or without anyone else commenting on this issue.  
I fully intend all my arguments to stand on their own. I fight my
own battles.

> but none of you want to state any facts, or even talk about diving.

As for talking about diving, I'd love to talk about diving.  My own
experience is very limited to the WKPP, I have no problem admitting that.
At the same time over the past few years (as a techdiver subscriber) I
have been able to answer some diving questions and help out
fellow subscribers.  

I am not, however, going to sit down, track down references, and 
write a reply when I think the original post is a fake by someone with 
nothing better to do than try to waste my time for their own damn 
personal enjoyment.  That is why I want the fakes to stop.

As for PGP, I don't like it.  I don't want any of it.  I think
its a pain in the ass.  I think the fakes are MORE of a pain
in the ass.  If something like PGP is the only way to stop them
then maybe it should be tried.  Personally I'd rather the fakes
stop.  Unfortunately the fakes are beyond my control.  Are they
within yours?

Recently we traded email on the idea of putting some kind
of authentication on the cavers list to reduce the number of fakes.
You claimed to me (and to others publicly) that you could fake/beat
anything.  Well as you always say, its time to step up and
pet the pony.

Very simple George, can you live up to your boast and
produce a faked PGP message that passes muster?  

You have no mercy on anyone else who makes a boast (and then can't 
back it up).  Why do you expect others to treat you to less than the
same standard.  *YOU* made it the issue.  *YOU* said PGP
was stupid (gay I think you said) and defeatable.  Again I don't 
like it.  But I like the fakes even less.

>      We have our on PGP , it is called "freeattic". There we have no strokes,
no 
> pot-smoking pontificators, no weeenies,  and no rules - we don't need them. 

Fine, you've said you guys have your own list.  Fake on that (if you must).
You can fake away there and present your weekly award over sushi.
Don't waste everyone (on cavers and techdiver) else's time with it.
 
>      You guys are the problem, we don't have any of this crap on our lists,
and 

hmm, WHO is the problem?  ME?  Are you saying *I* am faking messages?
Am I posting bogus dive information?  No, I am asking that the faking
stop.  Simple.  Nothing more, nothing less.

Mike

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