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> >> Safety is superior in the Odyssey because it does not rely on electronics > >> which will potentially fail, and in so doing allow a diver to become hypoxic > >> should there be a gas addition failure. > > > >give us all a break.. the greatest danger yet to be seen in any rebreather > >is the LACK of an indication of what you are breathing and when. > > >period. we all know that there have been hypoxic events with the rbc, and > >there will be more (if they indeed make the market), just like the drager. > > > Wrong Dennis! > The BMD had a hypoxic event, not the RBC, and the BMD had it because the > instructor wanted to let a student take hypoxia more seriously (he may have > been way wrong to do it, but it could only happen by plan). > you sure about that, yes we know that the event youre talking about was "by plan", but what about the 90footers that were done on the rbc the second week, was that not hypoxia, are you saying that it couldn't happen and didn't? why were they taken from the market? what about the two law suits? > > > > >> > >> Mike, step back and think for a second. We are having this conversation on a > >> technical diving list. People here dive multiple gases on typical dives. If > >> you have come up with a dive computer that senses me starting with air, > >> switching to tri-mix at 130 feet, tracks my nitrogen and helium saturation > >> on my 275 foot dive, figures the offgassing as I return to 150 where I > >> switch back to Nitrox , begins to figure counter diffusion and offgasing > >> with this switch, alows an air break at 50 feet for 15 minutes, and then > >> nitrox for next few stops, followed by pure O2 at 10 feet----If you have > >> come up with a computer that will do all this, how reliable is it, and how > >> many of us do you expect will trust it...The best divers I know, the guys > >> who go further and deeper into caves than ANYONE else, believe the ONLY safe > >> way to do technical exposures is with a pre-calculated profile and a bottom > >> timer and depth gauge....They don't trust ANY computer---why do you think > >> that is? > > > > > > >doesnt mean that is right, we were diving with a computer like the one you > >discribed four years ago. what makes you think there isn't one out there > >today. they used to say the same thing about pressure guages and bcds. > > > Dennis, where do you buy your gear from? I've used the "state of the Art", > Nemesis II Nitrox" for several months, and it fails constantly (and not just > mine, many other people have had the same pronblems). Ask others on the > list, like Carl for instance, if he can imagine electronics manufactured by > Cochran or any other computer mfg failing. Even if Cochran is the best > dive computer maker (because they have the best features) they may be many > years from a unit that is fail-safe....the big problem is that they were > willing to market the units heavily, irrespective of the risks associated > with placing a unit out there that still has many bugs in it---letting the > consumers become the R&D team. Guess what, when they do this with a > rebreather, already being done.. with the drager especially.. i paid lots of money to spend two weeks of my time to find out that <we> were doing the r&d for them. they won't just bend someone, they will KILL them. And this is > hardly limited to Cochran---the other air integrated computers (Air X, etc) > have PLENTY of failures. > I can't beleive you are willing to argue that ANY dive computer on the > market today is as reliable as a bottom timer or depth gauge....and this is > a comparison of electronic to mechanical. > > i have had five cochrin units for over two years now, yes we had problems with them in the beginning. one of the first set of four and minor problems with a prototype of the second, they were all easially fixed with updated software (our problems were in the down load systems that we used ALOT, and i mean daily). yes we wanted the batteries to last longer, but only because we constanly violated the units. i would expect from our experience and talking to other serious user\owners that the problems have been limited and over stressed. other than using the units for their download capabilities to document our dives and paramiters for study and analysis, all our coumputers (we have five cochrin, six pros, and a hand full of other older units, including an oceanic that we love to piss off) are used as you say, for bottom timers and back up info on deco. ALL our dives are pre planned to the minute with at least two contingencies.. AT LEAST TWO. We have used the cochrin and the airx and nitrox x in their full capacities and found no problem with either. i think you are talking about two different subjects here. > > > >again, belive it or not, we used a computer four years ago that did just > >that, care to comment tom?, who knows what is out there right now. we > >had a three hour conversation with the uwatek principals <last> dema show > >and they admitted to have worked on such an item.. just that the market > >was not ready for it (and could not support it). > > > More likely, the body count would not have been tolerable. > > again.. quite one sided. i don't think any one doing serious work dives, the divers most likely to have the equipment you are slamming, are going to bet their life on ANY one piece of equipment. especially when it comes to gas switches and deco profiles. hell, we even use two or three programs when planning the deeper dives... don't you? > i think the dive tracker > >could acutally do any and > >all of the above if programed. (what about it rob, come on kevin.. you out > >there... tell em the truth, tell em what brought you to iantd and > >techdiving). > > what, no comment her? > > > >myself.. i think it's about time someone started telling the truth about > >what is really going on. and to what end (if anyone can really figure > >that out, seems like people have their own adgendas for who knows what > >reason). > > The truth IS the real issue. Anyone who decides they want a rebreather > better damn well know the differences between closed and semi-closed, and > active addition vs. passive addition. In other words they better understand > the safety issues. > All I care about is making technical diving safer (I am not paid by ANY > rebreather company)---my motivation is my interest in technical diving. > Can you say the same? > absolutely... the very reason i have withdrawn from tdi. i feel that i was in a compromised postion when it came to what i could say and when. not any more.... feels pretty good. i rather think that you are not in as free a postion as you would have us believe. not that i am throwing disrespect at you.. dp
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