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BTW, I'm not part of any "group".

Geoff Kelafant
----- Original Message -----
From: <Hypohippo@ao*.co*>
To: <kelafant@we*.co*>
Cc: <cavers@cavers.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2000 8:33 PM
Subject: Re: cave deaths


>
>
> Geoff:
>
> I appreciate your thoughtful insight regarding this matter of cave deaths.
> Now yours is the type of posting that is well thought out, meaningful, and
> full of good information that can be of benefit to the members of this
group
> including myself.
>
> As far as your assuming that I meant being killed in a cave is inevitable
for
> all cave divers is completely off base.  What I said was that "as long as
> people continue to dive in caves their will be deaths. That is a simple
fact
> of the sport. I have been diving caves for many years and I am well aware
> that even the most safe and sophisticated cave divers do perish in caves
no
> matter how well they are trained or how experienced they are. The same is
> true for mountain climbers. Take Alex Lowe for example. He was probably
the
> most accomplished mountain climber in the world and died on a mountain by
> elements out of his control. Same with Anatoli Bukerov, Lopsong Shombo
Sherpa
> etc. etc. etc. etc.(forgive the MIS spellings of their names)
>
> It was not my intention to insitgate a long drawn out argument on this
> matter. I just simply wanted to point out that when someone is killed in a
> cave there should not be gleeful smirks of joy.
>
> As to your point that you and many others have to suffer the consequences
of
> a death with landowners, the State,  etc., is well taken.  I completely
> understand this concern and I too agree that people who are diving out of
> their limits (in this recent case, way out of their limits) should be
> discussed and investigated in a serious way. And if "training agencies"
are
> actually encouraging "intro to cave" divers to dawn on a pair of doubles
and
> head down to the Dome Room they should be severely punished.
>
> I understand what you and your group are trying to do. You are trying to
make
> diving safer which is of great benefit to the "community." I just feel
that
> some of our members would gain a lot more respect from us "non sided"
members
> by not taking the death of a "fellow diver" with so much sarcasm and glee.
>
> Much can be learned from the group (WKPP) which has penetrated the
furthest,
> dove the deepest, laid the most line, and has the best safety record in
the
> history of the sport. This is a non debatable fact.  My thoughts are to
use
> these facts, when commenting on a death, in a straight forward, non
sarcastic
> way while respecting the souls of the dead who undoubtedly died a
horrendous
> death. I believe that taking this type of approach will go a whole lot
> further with the diving public as well as the general public. No one
> appreciates sarcastic smart ass comments in the face of a true tragedy.
>
> Thank you for taking the time to respond.
>

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