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Lee, you position on trianing is the correct one. New divers with half training diving with other new divers is the most common death sentence in cave diving. Anything for a buck, but look who's teaching. On the entrance lines, Lee, forget the cave cert issue- the curious will go in. If they have a line, at least they have a chance. No line no chance, and the death toll there says I am right. Lee, the problems in cave diving can be summed up by your comment - "MONEY", and the mindless goobers who are making the rules. Lee and Lucy Gibson wrote: > > I agree that well marked T's are preferable to gaps, but changing the "old > system" will take some work. As for guidelines to the surface, it would depend > on entrance conditions and accessibility of the site to untrained divers. > As a past NACD board member, I consistently got out voted on the issue of > changing the training standards from the two tiered, cavern diver/cave diver to > the convoluted multistep system now in place. It was my position that someone > was a trained cave diver or they weren't...but the economic pressures and the > desire to promote courses out voted my Neanderthal non-user friendly position on > training. > Lee > > Drew Glasbrenner wrote: > > > Joel...I have visitors from Denmark at the moment so I'll be brief. I'd > > prefer Ts from the beginning, a permanent guideline to the surface at most > > sites, and getting rid of the training system as it is today. Teaching > > people half of what they need to know and turning them loose in the world is > > a dangerous proposition. The things I did on my Intro card would make people > > shudder on this list and makes me wonder why I survived. If I had been > > forced to take everything through Full in one shot I would not have been at > > such a risk. > > > > Let the list and the instructors hammer away, I'll sort it out and reply > > when I can. > > > > Drew > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Joel Markwell <joeldm@mi*.co*> > > To: Drew Glasbrenner <glasbrenner@mi*.co*>; O'Daniel, David > > <David_O'Daniel@bs*.bl*.co*> > > Cc: Cave listserv <cavers@cavers.com> > > Date: Sunday, March 12, 2000 8:08 PM > > Subject: Re: Gaps and T's > > > > >on 3/11/00 1:57 PM, Drew Glasbrenner at glasbrenner@mi*.co* wrote: > > > > > >> I'd prefer well arrowed T's any day. The only good thing I can say about > > >> gaps is that they help keep beginner divers out of areas they shouldn't > > be > > >> in and on the main line. Tees make it easier to route find. Imagine > > driving > > >> through a neighborhood where you could only see 50 ft and the roads > > lacked > > >> 75 ft of intersecting. > > > > > >Drew, > > > > > >So you would favor an improved version of what we have today? Gaps up to, > > >say 1200-1500' and T-s beyond that? > > > > > >Later, > > > > > >JoeL > > >
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