Joel, I had to read this whole thing before I realized that you are not
kidding. This is some of the dumbest reasoning I have ever heard.

***your quote " there may come a time when it ( deep air ) is needed" -
I guess you mean I should get my kids to practice drunk driving in case
they find themselves drunk and need to drive home? Doesn't work, tough
guy.

Joel, where does the air come from in a dive? I had to explain that to
Hal Watts a few years ago at Tek in New Orleans using Mr. Bottle and Mr
Compressor- the air can only be there if you bring it with you.

*** your quote "a clear head is no substitute for experience". Joel,
please. I give you the Wakulla 2 Project - heliox. Ask Bill Stone how he
would have done on air or trimix. I put the line in the cave. When I saw
that Stone was able to dive it with some of the absolute worst of the
worst, the WKPP shifted IMMEDIATELY to heliox for our rb diving. I give
Bill Stone full credit for PROVING this to me. I also give him credit
for proving that heliox is a superior gas to decompress from - he was
able to decompress the two Heinerth manatees successfully.

***your quote " USN and commercial use air to 200 feet". Joel name one
oil company or legitimate commercial operation using air - there are
none. You are talking about Cannadian seafood harvesters and other low
budget crap. The fact is that commercial diving has learned that brain
and spine lesions are the direct result of air diving to 200 feet. The
Navy bit is baloney. Real commercial uses real gases.

 Joel, why would it "behove" me to "be able" to dive air to 5.0 ppn2 ?
This is a claaic.

****your quote "  if a diver can't use that viable gas ( air ) to that
depth (175) they have no buisness diving below 100 feet". Joel, Mr.
Tough Guy, I CAN'T USE AIR SUCCESSFULY AT 175 FEET. Does that mean I
should not be diving and doing what I am doing, or does that suggest
that perhaps you have no idea what the hell you are talking about?

Joel, one more thing - look at the name of the list "techdiver", not
"narkdiver," "big shot diver", "tough guy diver", "deep air diver", or
"rec.scuba". Tech diving means not having to do stupid things, like Bill
Hamiton explained to Hal Watts at the same Tek conference, and it sure
as hell means not teaching stupid things. 
 
Please excuse this is you were in fact doing this toungue in cheek, if
not, well, I never expected anything this stupid out of you - I am
shocked.
 
Joel Silverstein wrote:
> 
> Dear Fellow Divers,
> 
> With the current state of gas availability using non-narcotic breathing
> mixes is not necessary to conduct dives deep with air. However it would
> behove most of those who are out there on the training and working end of
> this business to at least be able to work and function with N2 pressures of
> 5.0. There may come a time when it is needed.  As I look over this long
> list, it is pretty clear that most everyone here has done successful dives
> to 175 fsw (and deeper) with air (if not they would not be on the list).
> 
> Most if not all of use were doing air dives in the late 80's early 90's
> when the development of technical (read TRIMIX) was making its way through
> the scuba ranks. Key people like Billy Deans made the switch to gas and set
> the pattern for open ocean mix diving, but still he would consider 175 fsw
> for air to be a reasonable depth that people should be able to use air for.
>  The USN and most every commercial operation still uses air to depths of
> 190 fsw on a regular basis using hat and hose.
> 
> As much as we would like to STAMP OUT DEEP AIR -- there will always be
> those who will take anything and everything deeper than they should. We
> have little control of that. However, we can take them one at a time and
> provide them with the tools and information to make a rational informed
> decision as to what type of dive they will do.
> 
> I do not use air for any of our training deeper than 150 fsw. I do not
> belive that the students can conformably do the work they need to do under
> a greater level of narcosis. Frankly if a diver cannot use that viable gas
> to that depth then they have no business diving deeper than 100 fsw.
> 
> We need to keep in perspective that much of what we know today came from
> some brave (albeit misinformed) people who stepped out farther and deeper
> than others would care to at a time when they had a need to go look at
> something.
> 
> Unfortunately there had been some successful failures along the way. But we
> all learned from them. There were also successful survivors, who have been
> more than instrumental in the development of our activities.
> 
> We are about to go through a new cycle in divers. The accidents will rise
> because these divers have no reference point. The average diver today
> buying "techincal" gear has less than 50 career dives. What was once
> equipment for the "hard core deep divers" is now commonplace in most every
> dive store.  Just like fast cars, and fast planes, the inexperienced find
> this attractive and belive they can do things they are just not prepared to
> do. We each have a responsiblity to head that off at the pass. These divers
> need to put in a few hundred practicle dives before they can begin
> attempting some of these deeper dives, on ANY gas. A CLEAR HEAD IS NOT AN
> EXCUSE FOR EXPERIENCE. We each have a responsiblity to question Should they
> Dive Tech?
> 
> DEEP AIR
> 
> Air deeper than 175 fsw for practicle diving -- NO
> Air deeper than 150 fsw for training -- NO
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Joel Silverstein
> http://www.nitroxdiver.com

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