Barry's lights were copied by AUL what's this a time warp? I believe all
these lights are basically copies of another person's light. I believe
barrys lights came out quite a bit after AUL's although he did make some
changes to them. Before anybody has stroke AUL did not design them either.
English engineering I think was the first.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jesse Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>
To: Jim Cobb <cobber@ci*.co*>; Miller, Barry <rat@ne*.co*>;
Michel Therrien <m.therrien@ne*.qc*.ca*>; Pagefix@ao*.co*
<Pagefix@ao*.co*>
Cc: cavers <cavers@cavers.com>; Tech Diver <techdiver@aq*.co*>
Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 2:34 PM
Subject: Re: Pictures


>Sorry, Jim, gotta call bullshit here.  I could care less what language
>anybody uses.  If the stuff works, I buy it.  But then, I like Eddie Murphy
>and George Carlin, too.
>
>Barry lights work.  And Barry is a great guy.  I am told that AUL lights
>now work fairly well since they copied Barry's lights.  The web page,
>however is in the wrong.
>
>End of story.  Let's go back to talking about hose routing or upside down
>tanks or some other stupidity.
>
>Trout
>
>----------
>> From: Jim Cobb <cobber@ci*.co*>
>> To: Miller, Barry <rat@ne*.co*>; Michel Therrien
><m.therrien@ne*.qc*.ca*>; Pagefix@ao*.co*
>> Cc: cavers <cavers@cavers.com>; Tech Diver <techdiver@aq*.co*>
>> Subject: Re: Pictures
>> Date: Wednesday, March 24, 1999 11:46 AM
>>
>> Hey, Barry, you were doing great until that last sentence. I don't buy
>> this "holier than though" stuff of yours, either.
>>
>> You know, generally speaking, it never ceases to amaze me how
>> manufacturers or representatives come on to these public forums and
>> proceed to directly or indirectly piss off or alienate the very people
>> upon whom their income depends.
>>
>> Like it your not you are one of these manufacturers and getting on these
>> lists with long profanity laced tirades is simply not a bright thing to
>> do. For every person who supports you  there are ten or a hundred who
>> will take their business elsewhere.
>>
>> And a common saying in Marketing is "don't get mad, get even" my boy, if
>> you get my drift (wink, wink, nod, nod).
>>
>>    Jim
>>
>> Sender: Miller, Barry  Date: 3/24/99 12:13 PM
>>
>> >Mr. Cobb,
>> >   You could not be further from the truth. As a matter of fact, your
>view
>> >seems to be in the minority. The day that you do something then have
>> >someone steal it will show a change of attitude, that is the day you do
>> >something. It is very difficult to say anything without you and your
>> >friends throwing in the fact that I build equipment. I am not sure where
>> >you get that I am doing the marketing, maybe you need to go look at this
>> >web page and tell us again who is doing the marketing. I am speaking as
>an
>> >individual trying to protect what is mine, while these "people" are
>using
>> >my work to sell and promote their product. If one day I decide to use
>any
>> >of my work to promote anything I do and you don't like it, then you can
>> >also fuckoff.
>> >
>> >Barry
>> >
>> >
>> >At 10:59 AM 3/24/99 -0500, Jim Cobb wrote:
>> >>Oh for Christs Sake, lets get real here. The reason that the ratster
>has
>> >>his panties in a wad is the fact that this web site promotes AUL
>products
>> >>and not his gear. All this huff-and-puffery is just a smokescreen and a
>
>> >>bunch of baby-like boo-hooing that, frankly, does not reflect well on
>> >>Miller or his products.
>> >>
>> >>You are in the real world now, Miller, you need to start acting like a
>> >>business professional and not a redneck hillbilly pickemuptruck cowboy.
>
>> >>You need to take your marketing medicine like a man and quit belaboring
>
>> >>the list with your whining.
>> >>
>> >>   Jim
>> >>
>> >>Sender: Michel Therrien  Date: 3/24/99 9:29 AM
>> >>
>> >>>Dear Pagefix, (who is Pagefix?)
>> >>>
>> >>>I am not Barry's friend, nor a WKPP diver or affiliate.  I will admit
>that
>> >>>I don't always like the attitude of some WKPP leaders.
>> >>>
>> >>>This said, the reason why I wrote the message is not to defend
>Barry... it
>> >>>is a question of principle.  I have no tolerance for pirating,
>steeling and
>> >>>unethical behavior such as taking someones material without his
>permission.
>> >>> I propably have this attitude because I worked in the software
>industry (I
>> >>>don't know).
>> >>>
>> >>>Is there a reason why you stay anonymous?  This is another thing I
>have
>> >>>problem with... I guess.
>> >>>
>> >>>Please note that the issue for me is not legal... it is ethical. While
>the
>> >>>law may allow to copy someone's material for educative purposes, I
>don't
>> >>>think this is honest.
>> >>>
>> >>>Is it so hard to ask permission to use material PRIOR to using it? I
>was
>> >>>flattered that the NSS-CDS recently asked me to use some of my
>pictures.
>> >>>On the other hand, I would have been really pissed off if I saw my
>pictures
>> >>>without any prior discussion about their use.
>> >>>
>> >>>Michel Therrien
>> >>>Montreal, Canada
>> >>>
>> >>>PS: I know it is unethical to copy private messages in public forums,
>but I
>> >>>started public and I think your answer may help the rest of the crowd
>to
>> >>>understand your position.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>At 09:04 AM 3/24/99 EST, you wrote:
>> >>>>Michel the video was given to one of our sponsors and we took some
>clips of
>> >>>>it.  The law states that you can us this type of material as long as
>you
>> >are
>> >>>>not selling it to make a profit.  We e-mailed Barry with an apology
>for the
>> >>>>mistake and fixed the problem.  He didn't post that part on you
>cavers list
>> >>>>just the other parts that he wanted you to see.  The fact of the
>matter
>> >is we
>> >>>>would have agreed with what he asked but after the flaming he gave us
>we
>> >took
>> >>>>a defensive posture.  What is wrong with him has he no respect for
>> >>>anything or
>> >>>>one?  I am sorry if you want to punish AUL for Barry Millers Flaming
>and
>> >Lies
>> >>>>to us.  But if you feel like the only way to help Barry is kicking
>another
>> >>>>company so be it.
>> >>>>Most people don't use the language that Barry has used to a dog but
>if he
>> >>>>wants to talk like that it a free country and God bless him.
>> >>>>Please except our apologies for any misunderstanding and thanks for
>you
>> >>>input.
>> >>>>pagefix@ao*
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>--
>> >>>Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to
>`techdiver@aq*.co*'.
>> >>>Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to
>`techdiver-request@aq*.co*'.
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> Learn About Trimix at http://www.cisatlantic.com/trimix/trimix.html
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
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>>
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