Terry

Hmm, you lost me on that one.  The basis of the question that we both =
were responding to related to:

>casual dives less than 40mtrs (no deco)

My points related to understanding the dive and impact of overrunning =
the plan.  What I was suggesting was a significant amount of planning =
forming the basis of education, resulting in contingency plans but also =
an ability to place a bound on the deco should it be necessary.

Have a good life.

David Shimell

-----Original Message-----
From:	terry michael [SMTP:OEA51@go*.co*]
Sent:	Friday, May 25, 2001 4:19 PM
To:	David Shimell; Bruce Sherman; Techdiver List
Subject:	Re: Re: Computor

Shimell,
If you don't have a dive plan and a back-up contingency then you don't =
get in the water, not on my boat. I don't care who you think you are =
(unless you're George). Also you don't plan a decompression dive without =
gas and regulator redundancy!! that is a cardinal rule in my opinion. =
You are dangerous to yourself and others in my view, so I'll stay clear! =



-----Original Message-----
From: "David Shimell"<David.Shimell@ta*.co*>
To: "'terry michael'"<OEA51@go*.co*>, "Bruce =
Sherman"<bruce.s@co*.co*.nz*>, "Techdiver List"<techdiver@aquanaut.com>
Date: Thu May 24 09:33:25 PDT 2001
Subject: Re: Computor

>Bruce
>
>You're probably asking this question on the wrong forum, since the =
concept of "no-deco" dives is not really very techdiver  What you may =
wish to do is obtain some desk-top deco software and try out some =
scenarios.  Try what you may consider a no stop dive at 30m and add 10 =
minutes extra bottom time.  Is the deco significant?  How does it change =
if you go 20 minutes over the no stop time?
>
>How does this relate to the cylinders you carry?  Can you do 20 minutes =
over the no-stop time whilst maintaining sufficient reserve?  If not, =
then you have worked out an upper bound on your BT and the max deco to =
do.  If you dive single cylinders then you'll find that the max deco =
you'll need to do is what we Brits call bugger all.
>
>Try the same scenario with Nitrox.
>
>Dive computers are currently pretty poor at working out deco since =
their algorithm is maximised to avoid litigation.  However, the reality =
is that if you do dives close to the no stop zone, then there isn't too =
much penalty in using them.  The corollary is that there isn't really =
much point in using them as a bottom timer will work just as well.  When =
you get into gradual ascents (multi-level) dives, it gets less straight =
forward, but a little bit of common sense works here too.
>
>One of the key issues with dive computers is that people treat them is =
a reverence that is inappropriate to their status.  Ask yourself how =
comfortable would you be to bail out on your tables if the computer =
fails.  If you claim comfort, then practice bail-out on every dive.  Now =
you'll find that you don't need a computer.  However, if you are not =
comfortable given a computer failure, then you shouldn't be using one in =
the first place since it will fail.
>
>For the dives I do, I usually get out of the water 20-90 minutes before =
those using mixed gas computers or even crazy tables.  Surprisingly, =
there is a lot you can learn on the PC, but for it to be meaningful, you =
have to put it into practice by diving.
>
>Finally, I would caution you about listening to people that have a =
universal table that's always clipped off in their slate pocket (right =
thigh).  Although they may be doing the dives you do, it is likely that =
their experience is limited.
>
>David Shimell
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From:	terry michael [SMTP:OEA51@go*.co*]
>Sent:	Tuesday, May 22, 2001 6:44 PM
>To:	Bruce Sherman; Techdiver List
>Subject:	Re: Computor
>
>Bruce, It's all lip service in my opinion, most of the ones with the =
decompression software doing big dives on the computer at home, actually =
show up at the site for the "pussy dives" with no tables and a computer =
and some with just a BT. Next time you're in the water doing a buddy =
check call BU tables and see for yourself. As for me I dive the =
Buehlmann table and it's always clipped off in my slate pocket (right =
thigh). In order to forget it I'd have to forget my drysuit..:-)
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: "Bruce Sherman"<bruce.s@co*.co*.nz*>
>To: "Techdiver List"<techdiver@aquanaut.com>
>Date: Mon May 21 15:21:15 PDT 2001
>Subject: Computor's on dives to max 40mtrs - OK or Laziness ???
>
>>Ok, quick question. Each dive I do or have ever done, in any =
circumstance. Is done using a Uwatec bottom timer and tables (PADI wheel =
for dives less than 40mtrs with no deco) ( Stop Laughing this is a =
serious question) as I thought this was DIR.=20
>>
>>However I get the feeling that on lots or recreational dives, lots of =
people who dive DIR, use computors due to convienence. And I must admitt =
it would be more simples to use one, BUT I'm quite quick using the wheel =
(stop laughing) to calculate bottom times so there isn't really an =
inconvienence.
>>
>>SO my question is : Is DIR no computors for anything bar nothing ? and =
if so what tables etc are people using to calculate bottom times on =
casual dives less than 40mtrs (no deco)? or is using a computor on dives =
less than 40mtrs with no deco within the DIR frame ?=20
>>Cheers
>>Chaz
>
>
>___________________________________________________
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>
>
>--
>Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'.
>Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to =
`techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
>


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