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Don, you are right to worry=2E You've got people that admit they are not =20 technical divers and don't even have the basic knowledge and yet in a =20 very short time they are not only going to be doing this kind of diving =20 but teaching it? In the Undersea Journal (the magazine PADI doesn't let the customer see) =20 they have discussed how they don't like doing fitness checks for =20 non-professional certs as it is discouraging to the customers=2E An =20 instructor with a cave cert and 20 cave dives can become a cavern =20 instructor and teach the right way to dive in a cave on a single bottle=2E=20= =20 Nitrox, they said, was too complicated to teach until it became =20 profitable=2E They will either turn out divers woefully inadequate, =20 woefully incompetent, woefully ignorant or answer D, all of the above=2E Be afraid=2E > -----Original Message----- > From: Don=2EHoover@ds*=2Ecom > Sent: 02 November 2000 21:50 > To: trey@ne*=2Ecom; NPerry255@ao*=2Ecom; techdiver@aquanaut=2Ecom > Cc: quest@gu*=2Ecom > Subject: Recreational Tech=2E Diving > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > -------------- > George, JJ: > > Did you maintained a physical conditioning (i=2Ee=2E > running/cycling journal, > strength training, mile of swimming ect=2E) log that could be > correlated to > your decompression dives and Doppler examinations? Has Dr=2E > Hamilton examined > this relationship=2E The reason I am curious is that PADI will > launch their > "Recreational Tech=2E Diver" program next year and I have > friends who will be > training interested individuals=2E I explained to them the > other day how > important physical conditioning, proper physical examinations > of students > (PFO examinations, stress test ect=2E), diet, and understanding of > decompression diving and gas mixing will be to their > students=2E Neither are > Tech divers now but work for a shop that is TDI certified and > is training > them=2E I asked them what happens to their liability if they > have someone > stroke out because he/she had a PFO, only dives 5 times a > year(recreationally) and did not maintain proper physical > condition=2E They > had a blank look on their face=2E I am very concerned about > the sophomoric > divers who think this is just another form of recreational diving=2E > > > -----Original Message----- > From: trey@ne*=2Ecom [mailto:trey@ne*=2Ecom] > Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2000 6:01 AM > To: NPerry255@ao*=2Ecom; techdiver@aquanaut=2Ecom > Cc: GUE_Lista > Subject: RE: DIR clarification > > > Nelson, we originally went to Hamilton Research for custom > trimix tables=2E > Dr=2E Bill Hamilton is a physiologist and worked in oil company > and other > environments where mixed gas tables were first employed=2E What > he developed > for WKPP dives were initially very long schedules, which > actually helped our > gear thinking since Bill Gavin wanted to speed up the dives as much as > possible to avoid the long decompressions first believed to > be necessary=2E He > and I could add and survey 1000 feet of line every six minutes=2E > > When Parker died I became the one who interacted with Dr=2E > Bill and we used > me as the test subject for shortening the tables and changing > the shape, the > depth of the stops, and the gasses used=2E I boosted the helium > , again quite > by accident as I was also the survey guy, so I needed to be > mathematically > clearer=2E Suddenly I could do a whole lot less deco - the fist > thing that was > counter to conventional wisdom on helium=2E I could find no > deco that worked > reliably for weak mixes or air=2E Gavin and I tweaked the > tables repeatedly by > using software containing Bulhmann, but giving it false > values for helium > and oxygen percentages, like telling it the helium was lower > and the oxygen > higher than it was to get the right shape we believed was > better - it was=2E > > We changed from using 40% and O2 to inserting a 50% bottle to make the > intermediate stops more effective, and then started using the > 190 bottle for > deep stops=2E This JJ and I converted to 19X35 after several > iterations=2E Then > JJ started adding helium to the 120 bottle=2E I axed the > intermediate stops > way back in concert with Hamilton's recommendations and we > just smoothed it > out until we found the ideals using Doppler and me and JJ as > a test case =2E > JJ and I would hang around by the water in our dry suits in > case we had to > get back in, and get bubble checked until clear=2E > > The deco development down to reasonable schedules and > techniques that work > across the spectrum is one of our biggest contributions to > tech diving, and > trust me we got nothing but badmouthed and were fought all > the way on that > one=2E Notice now the Dr=2E Weinke and NAUI have now corroborated > our results > using the chamber at Los Alamos and sophisticated tracking techniques=2E > Notice they also allow teaching of DIR=2E > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: NPerry255@ao*=2Ecom [mailto:NPerry255@ao*=2Ecom] > Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2000 9:27 PM > To: trey@ne*=2Ecom; techdiver@aquanaut=2Ecom > Subject: Re: DIR clarification > > > Thanks for the historical perspective (always wondered about > "Hogarth!"); > it makes the posts more informative=2E=2E=2E Probably many List > divers (inc=2E me) > don't personally aspire to the extreme pioneer exploration > that WKPP does: > but your success and the knowledge gained -- and shared -- > benefits the > whole > tech diving community=2E Particularly important are the > radical changes in > decompression theory AND application, which you & JJ have put > to the test=2E > (On a small level, it was from the List that I learned to use > 50% O2 (not > 36%), pick a lower END (90') and incorporate proper deep > stops (GUE Deco > Planner or RGBM)=2E Safe diving, > Nelson > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: quest-unsubscribe@gu*=2Ecom > For additional commands, e-mail: quest-help@gu*=2Ecom > -- > Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to > `techdiver@aquanaut=2Ecom'=2E > Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to > `techdiver-request@aquanaut=2Ecom'=2E > > ______________________________________________________________ > __________ > This message has been checked for all known viruses, by Star > Internet, > delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre=2E > For further information visit: > http://www=2Estar=2Enet=2Euk/stats=2Easp > > > =20 Visit our web site at www=2Escott-wilson=2Ecom Privilege and Confidentiality Notice=2E This e-mail and any attachments to it are intended only for the party=20 to whom they are addressed=2E They may contain privileged and/or=20 confidential information=2E If you have received this transmission in=20 error, please notify the sender immediately and delete any digital=20 copies and destroy any paper copies=2E Thank you=2E Scott Wilson Scotland Ltd Registered in Scotland No=2E 48951,=20 Registered Office: 6 Park Circus, Glasgow, G3 6AX=2E UK=2E ________________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses, by Star Internet, delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. 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