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Zeca wrote: Zeca: Let me guess; you're a Stage 2 Loser at the moment? Hey, nothing to be a shamed of; I was one too. > Dear Fellows, > > 1- I am sure the behavior of most people in this list is not so good for > the diving community's health in the world. I'm quite sure that bad practices being called just that *is* quite healthy. If you got a problem with the message due to flawed logic within it, I would understand your objection. But it does sound as if this is another "u d00ds R mean" post. > 2- It could be more productive if most of you considered themselves as > "experts" in diving, came to this and other lists, and bring to the > community good concerns, lessons, experiences and words of winsdon, > instead staying fighting each other, exposing their insatisfactions, > psycologic disturbs as well as the "Hollywood Syndrome". As many before me has pointed out, death is not polite. And there's nothing polite about being killed because instructors whom you trust and pay follow unsafe practices and techniques, and are even *encouraged* to do so by the biggest, not leading, agencies. Something is wrong, Zeca, when you see tech instructors not as potential educators but rather death traps eager to add another one to their list of "accomplishments". I don't trust any IANTD instructors, Zeca, nor do I trust any TDI ones after learning about the way they do business and learning about the DIR philosophy. 99% of them don't get it when asked and instead become arrogant assholes intent on not giving away an inch, even though I know, they know and their friends know their logic is bullshit. They don't even *see* the other side's argument. Good thing we have the Swedish Brothers in Scandinavia. I feel sorry for large parts of the rest of the world. To argue passionately in the face of abject stupidity is not a sign of some psychological disturbances. To *demand* a cute and cuddly atmosphere in discussions regarding very harsh realities is, however. I get pissed when people screw around with my life just to make a little extra profit. I take it you sit back and try to find some "common ground" between the two of you? Here's a tip; the common ground is vaseline. > 3- I would like to say that, here in Brazil and in other countries that > I have visited, the opinion of the majority is that this list is a big > manifestation of psycologic disturbs and most of the people that have > been "discussing" here do not represent the real and healthy mental > divers in the USA. I honestly do not care what the majority of Brazilian divers or divers of other nationalities say - 99% of them do not know what DIR is or do serious diving. This cheap ass psychologizing is bullshit, and you know it. I think most Brazilians suffer from psychological disturbances since they run around almost naked playing music once a year. Yeah, built up sexual repressions, man. Please, if you got something to say, attack the message where it is flawed, not the way it id delivered. > 4- I would like to ask a simple question : Did you guys have seem the > great names of our planet, stupidly exposing their concerns and > thoughts in public with the primary objective of to create noises and > show up their EGO ? I guess no. Why not ? Think about that. Heh, the list if *uncompromising individuals* who has shaped the world is *long*. In fact, you will find few wussies amongst them. Even the geekiest of scientist is driven by a force that is hard to describe which leads him to kick ass and take names. Not even Ghandi favoured the "let's all be friends" approach. > 5- As the history has comproved, this kind of behavior and manifestation > just contribute to generate more instatisfation and cause a very poor > image of the most professionals in the world. Look, I'd rather be disgruntled for a day with some bruised pride than dead underseas forever. Damn it, it looks like people have wussed out since we became the dominant species. Life *is* harsh. Not getting any apple pie or people delivering a message in a harsh way ain't very harsh compared to some of the shit *you* encounter in technical *diving*. Or in normal diving, or even in your car on the way to work. > 6- For those that have been defending with nail and tooth a determinate > configuration, philosophy and etc.. Think about that in the history of > our humanity there was not a single and unique TRUE. There are suck, good and damned good ways. The DIR philosophy is the latter. Are you saying you cannot compare methods in terms of efficiency? If so you hold the opinion that a spare air is a good choice for a long distance exploration dive. > 7- Also, one of the many attributes of a good educator is just show the > "material" to the students and act as an true educator. Yeah, and show it for what it is. Show what's bullshit and why. That's what the WK. boys are doing. Guess they are good educators according to your own definition. > 8- I think if the behavior of most the people here was changed,and was > more effective, the diving community in the world probably will feel > better, learn much more under a very professional and human environment. I think most people rate saving lives higher than keeping everyone cuddly and happy, no? > > 9- If people here feel that acting this way will show experience, > knowledge and will become well known in the world, then know that it is > the opposite, because people have been making funny jokes about most > people in this list as well as have been creating a terrible image of > them as well as about some agencies and groups. Without bothering to find out for themselves. no? There are places where they can learn about the DIR philosophy in very polite way - loads of web sites. People who've bothered to check it out normally understand why there's a growing resentment towards the established industry. > 10- I think the representatives of significant groups and agencies, > should be careful about the consequences and results of this behavior in > the diving community and the diving industry. They are careful, which is why they're acting in the way they do, in the case of GUE and the WKPP. In the case of IANTD and TDI, those organizations are out of control, as the death toll shows. > I think instead of you guys, continuing to be not productive, and > generating poor discussion of who has the bigger....... think about take > a deep breath, make a consistent reflection and came to this list > bringing health contributions to our diving community. I regard this list as a very valuable learning tool and consider the DIR gang *very* productive people who bring lots of contributions to this list. Using a sometimes very direct language. > It is not also good for a people that belongs to the "First World" to > destroy and dirty this cultural and financial image. There's a reason we're the first world, and we're the because in the past our ancestors have been some outright bastards. But, they've guaranteed that we have the right to scream "fucking dumb" when we see something we regard as fucking dumb. There are some good first world systems running, but people are still people regardless of where they live. Now I firmly believe that you just have to get over your pride playing games with you when you subscribe to this list - some of the things you do will most likely be called "shit stupid", and for good reasons. It might even happen several times with long periods of time between. For instance, I can fully expect a few "fuck you, keep it short dickwad" posts because of my tendency to just go on and on about things. Hopefully I'll learn. Regards -- (Santa) Claus Lisberg Denmark -- Send mail for the `techdiver' mailing list to `techdiver@aquanaut.com'. Send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to `techdiver-request@aquanaut.com'.
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