OK, Richie, I am assuming you are 32 years old. That means I started
diving before you were born. I started when we moved to Florida when I
was a freshman in college.

We started using oxygen for deco and then mixing it with air for deeper
deco in the 80's, but we did not have a name for it. We were diving air.
We then tried helium.

At the time, the only shop that would let us bring in tanks with helium
was Brownies Third Lung, owned by one Robert Carmichael who at the time
was in his early 20's. We did call that trimix since we had heard the
word before. The reason we did it was to get onto the deeper wrecks for
spearfishing, as we could see some of the problems with air, but knew
verry little.

Then I started cave diving and met Parker Turner and Bill Gavin. Turner
pulled over to a phone booth my first week of cave class and called Jack
Vilas in Morgan City and bought me a Mini Ox analyser, when he found out
I was diving these gases based on partial pressure filling. 

I had taken a nitrox course two years earlier form a guy that was
training under Rutowski's oraganization, of which Mouth was a member I
think. That was when our institutional office was in Miami, and I took
the course in Coral Gables. We never did any dives with it, and I had to
show the guy how to do all of the math. I took the courses only because
I believed he would fill my deco tanks - he would not - only "NOAA
Nitrox 1". That is how long ago we started doing this.

That was well before your boy Stone decided to make you hero to the
geeks by giving you a cis lunar to play with. In fact, that was before
there was a play-with version. I remember seing you at the Tek shows
once there was a show-and-tell version. I was there discussing what I
had already done, not what I was "planning to do".

Anyway, Richie, the bottom line is in the record books, and the reality
is that as I learned, so did eveyone else as I shared my information  ,
and as I found better information , I corrected any bad information
without hesitating to point out when I had been wrong. You start doing
that, and provide the kind of information that is useful to all like I
do, instead of the balony about things that are better not done or done
correctly, or things that are said under the umbrella of those who keep
you ticking and made you an action figure in the geek department, and
then criticize my contributions.

You put together a giant team and thousands of man hours of hard
informantion and proof, and then come compare it to my work before you
start citicizing and being a smart ass - I am a lot better at both than
you are, and there is nobody on this planet who can keep me from telling
the truth about anything, as we have already seen. I do not care what
they do for me, I do what is right no matter what. You have too many
people to please to be useful to us.

By the way, in the gas department the WKPP had been doing trimix dives
in a fashion that anyone could do prior to anyone else, and came forth
with that information . Your boy Bill Stone diving heliox on a one shot
basis with air for deco did little to develop anything ( other than his
bullshit like saying that the helium leaked out of the tanks and left
the oxygen and other FAS comments), just like his last project produced
nothing that anyone can adopt for their diving other than to prove that
helium is a superior gas for diving ( as evidenced by idiots being able
to dive) and for decompression ( as evidenced by fat slobs and misfits
living through it), and that the buddy system needs to be used ( as
evidenced by the sensational death of a Nobel Prize winner at Wakulla)
and that ccr's are easy to use on the one hand ( since he had morons
diving and they lived) and extremely dangerous on the other ( as he
showed when an MIT physicist could not use one properly). You have of
course confirmed these findings in your one-man sample.

Anything else you want to talk about before you go back to Geekville and
the safety and comfort of the worst collection of pencil necked , coke
bottle glasses, stink breath pocket protector non-diving geeks on the
planet ( the "rebreather" list )?



Richard Pyle wrote:
> 
> > Richie, before you started diving is the correct answer, unless you
> > started at about age 2. I will be glad to pull the scorecard on you and
> > run through some of the more ridiculous stuff, if that will help jog
> > your memmory.
> 
> O.K., let's see the scorecard.  Let's pick an easy one:  When was the first
> time you breathed a mixture containing helium underwater?  Be truthful
> now -- I already know the answer.
> 
> > The difference between me and you is that I lack anything to prove to
> > anyone
> 
> That's sort of an odd statement.  If we compare the volume of email you've
> contributed to this list over the last couple years to the volume I've
> contributed, and especially if we examine the postings for relative content
> of "chest-beating", which one of us has established a pattern of trying to
> "prove" something, and which one of us has continued on doing what we do,
> with very little boasting?  What, exactly, do I have to prove, and to whom;
> and upon what basis would you make such a statement?
> 
> >, and when I do something wrong , like deco on air, or when I find
> > something better, I make the change and admit my mistake and talk about
> > why.
> 
> Right.  Shall we compare the openness and honesty with which each of us has
> reported our respective encounters with bends symptoms?  Look at all of your
> public reports of bends and all of my public reports, and try your best to
> construct a case whereby you are more forthcoming in admitting your own
> mistakes.  But warn me ahead of time, so I won't be drinking when I read the
> post - my moniter is nice and clean and I want to keep it that way.
> 
> > You clearly do not. You are more like a land crab who backs into the
> > corner with his claws up. In fact, you were still in a wheelchair from
> > one of your 220 air bounces when I set a record for distnace in a deep
> > cave on trimix.
> 
> Huh?  Last time I was in a wheelchair following a 220-foot dive (actually, I
> had pain only after the deep dive, which was more like 250; the neurological
> symptoms came after a later dive to 140) was 1986.  You set a record for
> distance in a deep cave on trimix in 1986?  Which cave was that?
> 
> > Ask Mount - he was on the boat when I did one of my first trimix dives,
> > and he told everyone to ignore me ( and still does ), that I was nuts
> > and that I would get "helium bends" like Hal Watts did. A few years
> > later he started IANTD.
> 
> So you did your first trimix dive only "a few years" before the formation of
> IANTD?  Sorry, fella, but you're going to have to go a lot further back than
> that to substantiate your claim of having done this stuff "a hell of a lot
> longer" than I have.
> 
> > You were about 15 then, big time.
> 
> Now we're back to 1982.  So...you're trying to tell us that to did your
> first trimix dive in 1982?  Wow, that is impressive. But wait, that would be
> a full 10 years before Tom first got involved with IANTD.  So what you're
> saying now is that you did your first trimix dive a full *decade* before Tom
> started with IANTD? Very impressive indeed.  But who was your dive buddy on
> this amazing 1982 dive?
> 
> Look, I really don't care what the real answer is.  I don't want to back you
> into a corner, because whenever that happens, things get ugly -- and nobody
> on this list will benefit from that.  I've already wasted enough bandwith
> with this little exchange of ours (and I accept fully half the blame for
> that - my apologies to the others on this list), and since I'm only an
> occassional visitor to this list, I don't want to piss off any of the
> regulars by engaging in yet another senseless battle of egos with you.
> Nobody is getting anything useful out of this, no matter which one of us has
> the bigger phallus. I used to enjoy this little game of ours, but the
> novelty has long worn away.  The only reason I stepped back in on this
> thread is that I've been sick these past few days, so have not been able to
> get much else done. I'm feeling better today, so I'm going back to work. You
> go back to telling everyone about deep cave records, and I'll crawl back to
> the rebreather list, where I belong.
> 
> Aloha,
> Rich
> 
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