Paolo, the mask you describe seems similar to the new ScubaPro mask,
with the DIN ports, oral/nasal separation, etc.  As for the mounting of
an additional second stage to a FFM, I would like anyone to try and
explain the logic of this to me.  If you are wearing a properly fitting
hood, the only part of your body exposed with a standard mask/reg is
your upper lip.  I am not an expert in human physiology, but I suspect
that heat loss from your upper lip is not significant over the course
of a dive.  FFM's really present an unacceptable level of risk unless
you can justify them, and that means contaminated water, necessary
hardwire comms, blackwater, swiftwater or O2 tox risk.  Neither the
minor warmth gain, nor "curiosity" outweighs the additional risks
incurred by FFM's.

When they are necessary, this is how I configure them:  The FFM is
attached to the short hose (left post as per DIR), and feeds from the
right like any normal second stage.  The long hose is clipped off and
so is available at any time.  The backup mask (in case I need to bail
out of the FFM) is carried either in an immediately accessable pocket,
or is worn backwards around the neck.

FFM's for oxygen deco are of course simply attached to the deco reg.

-Sean


On Wed, 27 Jan 1999 18:50:48 +0100, Paolo Velcich wrote:

>Thanks for your replies, I got a vey hot welcome on this list, I was al=
ready
>at the windows for some weeks and found it quite interesting.
>
>I would give an explanation about my choice for the full face mask. The=
 cold
>water is a truth in this part of the Adriatic sea and it partially just=
ify
>the growing drysuit market. Until recently there were only few full fac=
e mask
>available on the market and (not mentioning Kirby Morgan's) the Aga was=
 just
>the only serious thing around.
>Something is changing on this fron too and some other newer and more
>sophisticated models appeared on teh scene. One of those is the OceanRe=
ef.
>As an industrial designer and underwater enthusiast, I'm really curious=
 and
>wanted to put my hands on a new toy...:-) but the first model didn't co=
nvince
>me too much and didn't purchase it.
>
>Last year I was contacted by some friends, there was a FFM courses inco=
ming
>on request and they asked me about known models and availability. The n=
ew
>model NIRA (which incorporates a custom compact second stage) was just
>released and I purchased some for the group and one for me, the cost wa=
s
>affordable and I could satisfy my inner curiosity.
>
>I must say I found it very confortable, really, and even if it actually=

>increases the air consumption by a little, the general comfort and the =
less
>heath dispersion in the 5=F8 C water helps to more than compensate for =
that.
>The wearability and visibility provided by this mask is very good, only=
 the
>ESA mask did something better with the lower windows for reading instru=
ments.
>Foggy is almost unexistent on this mask even if you're sweating hard. A=
nd
>it's almost impossible to flood it. We deliberately moved it even four =
or
>five centimeters away from the face but water didn't come in...
>Another positive side of this tool is the reduced fatigue in the mouth =
since
>you're not dealing with the mouthpiece and - if necessary - you can spe=
ake to
>your buddy if close (1m is OK).
>Removing the mask has been made easy by a quick release system on the
>backsides of your neck.
>The CO2 accumulation is a potential hazard for any full face system, th=
is
>mask uses a good design concept to avoid it and the air circulation ins=
ide
>helps to keep the mask clean.
>
>The mask provides two DIN sidemount holes for a communication system an=
d an
>auxiliary regulator. The secondary regulator port is provided with a on=
e way
>valve so you can open it, mount the second stage (with the adapter), ju=
st
>place it there and it's working, then you have your time to close the r=
ing
>and have it steadly mounted on your right side. You could have it perma=
nently
>on, but this practice - even if it's possible - is not suggested.
>
>Any drawback on this jewel? Yes, of course there're, I must admit its
>incorporated second stage works fine but it's far from excellence, it's=
 a bit
>too hard expecially in the first meters below the water surfcae. When y=
ou
>dive deeper it works well but if you're used to an Abyss or any other t=
op
>quality regulators, it's another world.
>I hope there will be replacements in the future. You can obviously moun=
t a
>thirdy part regulator via the supplied adapter, but I don't really like=
 that
>long trunk.
>
>I purchased it more for curiosity than for any other reason, since that=
 day I
>didn't removed it from my gear and I'm very happy with it. I used it in=
 very
>cold lake water and I never experience free flow. The flow regulation o=
n the
>second stage works quite well. I'll experiment it under ice during this=

>week-end, I'll let you know if problems occurred or not.
>
>Keep this list going vital and motivate.
>
>Deep blues and blue skies
>
>
>"Sean T. Stevenson" wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 26 Jan 1999 20:22:04 -0500, Jim Cobb wrote:
>>
>> >It is interesting that you use a FFM, is the water particularly cold=
? Do
>> >lots of divers over there use FFM's? I have not tried one, they don'=
t
>> >look very comfortable. Plus you can't change gas very easily.
>>
>> I don't want to start the whole FFM thread again, but for the sake of=

>> anyone new who reads this, cold water is the absolute worst possible
>> justification for the use of full face masks.  I dive exclusively in
>> cold water, and routinely see people gearing up for ice dives with
>> FFM's so they can keep their face warm.  These things freeflow with
>> unnerving frequency - especially in cold water, they present an extra=

>> dead gas space and so contribute to increased CO2 loading, and if you=

>> do need to bail out of one, that can be quite a shock if the water is=

>> freezing.  As Jim pointed out, they interfere with gas
>> switches/sharing, and depending on the design of the mask, will
>> actually increase your gas consumption.  I occasionally use a ScubaPr=
o
>> FFM for search and recovery work, if the water is contaminated or if =
I
>> need hardwire comms, and less frequently, for deco hangs if I am
>> worried about toxing, but I would rather use a normal mask and reg no=

>> matter what the water temperature.  I have yet to see anyone lose the=
ir
>> upper lip to frostbite from diving.
>>
>> -Sean
>> DIR(ODDIAA)
>
>--
>Paolo Velcich
>industrial designer
>**********************
>KORUM DESIGN
>Viale Tricesimo 5/6
>33100 - UDINE - ITALY
>Tel. (+39)0348-2611707
>e-mail: pavel@ma*.na*.it*
>http://www.nauta.com
>**********************
>
>


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