Don't forget Jesse we were the ones that had to go in and fix the mess
these guys made. These guys couldn't even get a reel out to amend the
cluster they had in there.

Chris

On Wed, 7 Oct 1998, Jess Armantrout wrote:

> WKPP - 8000 manhours, no troubles. Not too shabby.
> 
> Last time a usdct diver dove at wakulla (2 months ago?) he was solo, got
> lost in air clear water, broke the line and could not find the entrance to
> B tunnel where he had been before.  And that was on open circuit.
> 
> And you wonder why I am concerned?
> 
> No special reason.
> 
> Jess
> 
> ----------
> > From: Richard Pyle <deepreef@bi*.bi*.or*>
> > To: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>; dive4wrk@pi*.co*
> > Cc: Jeff Bentley <jeffbentley@mi*.co*>; Tom Mount
> <TOM.MOUNT@wo*.at*.ne*>; Bill Mee <wwm@sa*.ne*>; Rebreather mail
> list <rebreather@nw*.co*>; cavers@ca*.co*; techdiver
> <techdiver@aquanaut.com>; "Dan Volker" <dlv@ga*.ne*>; kirvine@sa*.ne*
> > Subject: RE: WKKP: Love, Hate, CCRs and the USDCT
> > Date: Wednesday, October 07, 1998 4:10 PM
> > 
> > 
> > Hi Jess,
> > 
> > Did it ever occur to you that if a WKPP diver was killed, it might affect
> > the USDCT's access? It's a two-way street.  It's infintely clear that you
> > folks are of the impression that a WKPP diver is much less likely to die
> > than a USDCT diver is at Wakulla.  Problem is, you don't really know
> enough
> > about the USDCT divers, or their equipment, to make that assessment. The
> > WKPP certainly knows more about diving deep and long at Wakulla than
> anyone
> > else on Earth.  Nobody is arguing that.  Unfortunately, that alone does
> not
> > allow you to accurately compare relative risks faced by each team.
> > 
> > There's a bit of hypocrisy here as well.  Your argument seems to be that
> you
> > know more about diving at Wakulla, so we should take your word for it.
> The
> > problem is, you repeatedly demonstrate a gaping knowledge of how the Mk-5
> > works, but you seem utterly convinced that it is a wholely inappropriate
> > life-support system to be used in that environment.  Jess, as far as the
> > ability of a diver to survive on a MK-5 under EXTREMELY adverse and
> > stressful circumstances...well...I guess you'll just have to "take my
> word
> > for it".
> > 
> > Aloha,
> > Rich
> > 
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Jess Armantrout [mailto:armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*]
> > > Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 1998 7:52 AM
> > > To: dive4wrk@pi*.co*
> > > Cc: Jeff Bentley; Tom Mount; Bill Mee; Rebreather mail list;
> > > cavers@ca*.co*; techdiver; "Dan Volker"; "Richard Pyle";
> > > kirvine@sa*.ne*
> > > Subject: Re: WKKP: Love, Hate, CCRs and the USDCT
> > >
> > >
> > > Great post.  Thanks for the input.
> > >
> > > The problem is when they kill somebody, it will most likely affect our
> > > access.  If I told you the next Cis fatality would mean the end of
> ocean
> > > diving, perhaps you could appreciate the situation a little more.
> > >
> > > As to the SAT analogy, Stone & Co would be safer trying to pull that
> off
> > > than diving A tunnel on the Cis.  If you did it, it can't be that hard.
> > >
> > > As you say, I've been there done that, and until you have, I
> > > guess you will
> > > just have to take my word on it.
> > >
> > > Jess
> > >
> > > ----------
> > > > From: Joseph Dituri <dive4wrk@pi*.co*>
> > > > To: Jess Armantrout <armantrout@wo*.at*.ne*>
> > > > Cc: Jeff Bentley <jeffbentley@mi*.co*>; Tom Mount
> > > <TOM.MOUNT@wo*.at*.ne*>; Bill Mee <wwm@sa*.ne*>; Rebreather
> mail
> > > list <rebreather@nw*.co*>; cavers@ca*.co*; techdiver
> > > <techdiver@aquanaut.com>; "Dan Volker" <dlv@ga*.ne*>; "Richard Pyle"
> > > <deepreef@bi*.bi*.or*>; kirvine@sa*.ne*
> > > > Subject: Re: WKKP: Love, Hate, CCRs and the USDCT
> > > > Date: Wednesday, October 07, 1998 12:00 PM
> > > >
> > > > Jess & Jeff,,
> > > > 	It's nothing like putting a Sosiss array out of a SAT system at 850+
> > > > feet with excursions to 1200 feet either.  And I know neither of you
> has
> > > > done that...  Stop swinging the "I did it and you can't thing."  If
> they
> > > > have leanring to do in "A" tunnel, then let them learn JUST LIKE YOU
> HAD
> > > > TO DO.  It wasn't that long ago that you would not have dreamed of
> being
> > > > where you are today.
> > > > 	What if there was a group shouting at you telling you you would kill
> > > > yourself when you started your quest for the end (or whatever you are
> > > > doing)...  If your rely concerned for their safety, call STONE and
> ask
> > > > him if he wants your "expert help"  If not, sit back and watch.
> > > > Whatever you do, lay off the "Holier than thow stuff".
> > > > 	I have a headache :)
> > > > WARM REGARDS
> > > > JOE
> > > > > Jeff
> > > > > These guys have no clue the level of concentration it takes
> > > to dive "A"
> > > > > tunnel.  When they try it for real, these discussions will
> > > end once and
> > > for
> > > > > all.  It ain't like Madison Blue's basin or the run between Little
> > > Devil's
> > > > > and Devil's Eye.
> > >
> 

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