your right George, you may know a lot about diving,  so I guess that
makes you 
a scuba God.  If we don't dive your way, we must just be dumb ass
strokes.  That's
right WKPP is the only ones in the world who know how to dive.  I am so
tired of hearing
how great you and your WKPP are.  I agree with a lot of what you say, I
just can't stand
the attitude that comes with it.

Rob Calkins

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	G. Irvine [SMTP:gmirvine@sa*.ne*]
> Sent:	Friday, August 29, 1997 7:50 PM
> To:	Peter Heseltine
> Cc:	techdiver@aquanaut.com; rebreather@nw*.co*
> Subject:	Re: Palmer, Parker, Exley and McFaden
> 
> BULLSHIT on all counts. That was the third dsy of this activity ,
> Pete. 
> This was a deep air death, and all of you who are trying to cover it
> up
> and deny it are proving that you just don't know much about basic
> diving. Go back and look at the gear descriptiuon, the original
> report,
> and then look and see it was the usual suspects, and that the story
> changed ten times, just like the rebreather accident stories that we
> hear, and in fact these guys were so anxious to dispel the notion that
> it was rebreather related, that they spilled the beans on the deep
> air.
> One of the morons even put it in wirting that the dive was planned to
> "ninety meters: Pete only a stroke dives to 90 m on air.
> 
>   The bottom line is that the guys is dead from deep air - how he got
> thjere is called peer pressure, and if you want to blame it on
> borrowed
> gear, or whatever - then it is just plain stupid, and like you say,
> "out
> of character" as we knew him, and an extreme waste. Don;t make it
> worse
> by lending your name to the concept that this was anything but a
> strokefest ending in death.
> 
>   Pete, why was the boat OFF the wall? I can tell you from doing it
> myself: you can't get deep enough if you have to swim away once down -
> remember you have to0 do these dives very fast - most of these have a
> "shoreline" at 320, and you need to swim out a ways to get the 400+
> stuff. You then come up back into the wall. Don't tell me about no
> depth
> sounder, the edge is clear as day. This was an intentional deep air
> operation.
> 
>   I konw a lot more about this sport that you have the time to ever
> learn, and I am calling it an obvious deep air death.
> 
> 
> Peter Heseltine wrote:
> > 
> > Geo -
> > 
> > At 04:28 PM 8/29/97 -0400, G. Irvine wrote:
> > >Pete, I have it from those who were last diving in the Bahamas with
> Rob
> > >that he was in fact doing .. intentional deep air diving), and
> > >from some in the UK who said he was doing that in the Red Sea.
> > 
> > I guess this seems so out of character and the reports (printed and
> spoken)
> > all say that he was in trouble long before he got to ~200, where at
> the
> > earliest, he might have taken an O2 hit. My point was that he might
> have
> > been dropping fast (he was off a wall, but in 1200m according to
> Bill
> > Hamilton) because he was heavily weighted and was using borrowed
> equipment
> > (also from Bill). What was to stop him? His BC; the most poorly
> maintained
> > part of any borrowed kit. It's almost a badge of honor to see
> someone
> > wearing a faded, tattered BC, too often with an LP hose of the same
> > vintage. Would you put a reg in your mouth that looked like that? So
> why
> > strap on 30lbs and drop over the side into the blue without checking
> it's
> > working or at least having a plan if it doesn't.
> > 
> > >In this...
> > >kind of diving, both deep air drops and Exley's thing, they try to
> get
> > >down as fast as possible ( even though Exley told me the HPNS would
> be a
> > >real problem), so yes, a bc problem would be bad, and Exley was
> wrapped
> > >up in the line, but then how do we have those prpoblems , Pete,
> when we
> > >are prepared properly unless we are impaired improperly?
> > 
> > My point exactly. All the equipment needs to be prepped, including
> the
> > flotation.
> > 
> > > Pete, the problems are as follows: Rule Number One. Option Number
> One.
> > >To wit, "don't dive wtih strokes" ( only a stroke dives deep air),
> and
> > >"Don't dive", meaning, if you can not do it right all the way for
> > >whatever reason, do not dive. This means even if you just don't
> feel
> > >like it.
> > 
> > You're right, but we've all been there - a great dive and a single
> > "non-essential" piece of equip that's not right - and we still go.
> We are
> > just luckier than they are.
> > 
> > >Peter Heseltine wrote:
> > >> Let's assume that George is right - just for a moment ;-)
> > >>George replied:
> > > BTW, this is usually a safe bet. - G
> > 
> > "Unfortunately, knowledge of the facts does not necessarily alter
> the
> > behavior"
> >      - ?
> > "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes."
> >      - Oscar Wilde
> > 
> > "Good judgement is the result of experience, and experience is the
> result
> > of bad judgement"
> >      - Walter Wriston
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