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John Rose I think when yopu went through the trtaining course you did around 800 minutes of bottom time also which included a 75 minute stage dive at DE. You also did a 100 minuter plus Peacock dive if my memory serves me correctly. Yes the stage dive is optional but about 90 percent of the divers I train opt to do it. Long dives with practice on technique is what make a cave diver eficient and good. It is for this reason that I insist on a minimum of double 100's to accept a student. I rarely have a dive shorter than 50 minutes in duration in a cave course.This is a common thing I have always done in cave classes since the 60's and is one others such as Parker turner practiced. Ask George about freezing to death on some of his long dives with Parker. John in your case as you have pointed out it was the time in the water beginning in the course that enabled you to become as proficient as you have in a relatively short period of time. Yes this type of training is physcially demanding and I forewarn all my students that I expect them to be in reasonable good condition at the beginning of the course and most beleive me others just get quite tired. The way I train students is not for everyone and is not the same as many instructors opt to do. I also do not accept all the divers who apply to do training with me. I prefer to train people who are serious about their intentions to cave dive thus I do not train cavern or introductory cave divers.I think those programs are the core element for most who are curious about cave diving or who have less than 100 dives under their belt. Tom You wrote: > >> >> <sorry to repost this.. the subject was hosed on the first round> >> >> Hi Tom, >> >> Does this type of training make sense? I don't think >> this was part of the curriculum when I went through the mill. > >This kind of training makes a great deal of sense for students that have >finished cave training. The only way to learn cave diving is by cave >diving. Actual bottom time is more important that simply the number >of dives. A beginner can get a lot more out of a long dive, assuming >that the dive is within his ability, than he can out of a bunch of short >dives that sum to the same bottom time. One thing that Tom didn't state >is that stage dives are an option that students are not obliged to >participate in. Don't forget that students are paying to dive with >capable divers, their instructors. It is to their advantage to get as >much bottom time as possible. >This marathon dive was probably optional and done after the students had >satisfied training requirements. For these students, it was their first >really long cave dive. Don't you think it is a good idea to do this with >an instructor? Remember that an important part of learning to cave dive >involves diving with people that have abilities superior to your own. > >> Why not require the student to be in Good++ physical condition >> so that this type of situation is very unlikely? > >Being in good physical condition does not mean that the techniques you >have learned have been fully ingrained. Practice makes perfect. > >> I have never been so tired that I could not maintain technique. >> I have been tired enough that I had to slow my pace down a bit. > >Yes, but you implied that you never did this kind of dive when you went >through the mill. So, who is to say that your techniques wouldn't have >suffered had you done such a dive at that time. > >> (As a silly question... Why not train them to maintain technique >> when they suffer from hypothermia? See what I'm saying? ) > >You are right. Not only is it silly question but it is a non sequitur. >I don't see what the problem is when an instructor offers to do a >post-training stage dive with students that are interested. > >-John > >
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