Mailing List Archive

Mailing List: techdiver

Banner Advert

Message Display

Date: Sun, 03 Mar 96 18:56:25 EST
From: John 015 <CC015012@BR*.br*.ed*>
Subject: Re: gas exchange rates as they effect nitrogen
To: techdiver@terra.net
>Posted on 2 Mar 1996 at 23:45:14 by Dan Volker

>I think my point might be better described by the differences in how
>much blood (which relates to surface area) can be exposed to a gradient.

This is my view too.  I had dreams about this all night long
and woke up with a model I'm thinking of building further on.
I dubbed it the 015 Unified M model (c).


Important assumptions are:

The fit and the unfit diver share many tissues which we'll
model as compartments.  The fit and unfit compartments
share diffusion rates D, halftimes 1/D, gas solubility and
possibly M values.

Some tissues differ: especially the vascular system, % bodyfat
and muscle-gas-(dissolved)-exchange-rates.

I cannot for the life of me see the ongassing and offgassing
go at different rates unless the membrane between vessel
and tissue support a different molcular flux depending on the
direction of the N2 gradient across that membrane.  Within the
tissue itself the diffusion is determined by the "chemical"
diffusion rate.  The is no information available to the
thermally activated molecules which tells them to slow
down or speed up.  They just merrily perform random walks
in arbitrary directions.
(This is the opposite of what some have stated [ unfit
person ongasses into slow compartments but offgas those
slow ecompartments even slower].  We've seen no proofs so
I take it to be wrong for now ).

However, there is a remnant of the above problem in a
dive that starts out with the fatty tissue warm and
where the fat diver chills throghout the dive.
Diffusion will slow if the temperature drops but
the biggest effect is probably due to the capillaries
themselves shutting down the flow of blood in cold
tissue.


I am unware of bubble formation being a problem if it
should occur outside of the vascular system.  It's size
should it occur in elastic tissue would seem to have an
upper bound equal that of the host cell and it can't travel
anywhere. I.e., it has no effect as far as DCI is concerned.



Where does this lead us.

Well, the fit diver has the same set of compartments as
the unfit diver.  Having a vastly better circulatory system
with more surface area and shorter distances over which
the N2 gradient can drive N2 in or out of tisse the fit diver
has more a higher percentage of his total mass in the faster
compartments.

But that's all we can get from the compartmentalization.

Now the diffusion rates.  These are given when the compartment
half times are given.  Solubility remains the same (assuming
same chemical build-up of "same" tissue in fit and unfit person
and barring temperature effects).

However, a compartment that ongassed "warm" and now offgas "cold"
must be treated as two different compartments.  This poses
no particular problem for now.

We're left with the M values.

If the probability of a bubble forming in the vascular system
supplying that fatty tissue is p(fat) per litre of fatty tissue
then a person with m kg of fat will see a total probability
of bubble formation due to the fatty tissue as pM = P(fat).

Similarily, the fit person has more risk of bubble formation
in the muscles and the vasculatory system itself just by
having more of it and  light of it's faster rate of offgassing.

Being a model with adjustable M parameters I'll also
incorporate some of the "chilled diver" effect mentioned above
into the M values.

The M values are therefore functions
of compartment, relative compartment mass, depth, gas/mixture,
temperature and possibly more if the model is refined to include
max depth, level of excersise etc. Fat and VO2 will input
through the relative compartment mass dependence.

In this model then the fit person can afford to lower the M
values of certain (all?) slow compartment but must increase
the M values of the relevant fast compartments.

I could argue further that a fit person can take a bit
more bubbles in his system (a larger percentage of the bubble
laden blood is circulated into non-critical tissue) but
this must be weighted against the increased risk of
bubble nucleation in the more volumios an possibly more
vigorous vascular system of the fit diver.


The change in M values does support Dan's need for
deep stops and the unfit person's needs for spending
time shallow.  Some might argue I built it into the
model right away :-).


Comments welcome.

john

Navigate by Author: [Previous] [Next] [Author Search Index]
Navigate by Subject: [Previous] [Next] [Subject Search Index]

[Send Reply] [Send Message with New Topic]

[Search Selection] [Mailing List Home] [Home]